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Post by JustJohn or JJ on Jul 19, 2016 8:01:34 GMT -7
Post- Coup Turkey will be Distinctly EurasianBy Andrew Korybko Global Research, July 17, 2016 The aftermath of the failed US-directed and Gulen-inspired coup attempt is already making itself clear, with Prime Minister Yildirim stating that Turkey might reinstate the death penalty to deal with the plotters. This statement is just as symbolic as it is substantial, since not only does it disprove allegations that Erdogan “planned this” himself for some Machiavellian purpose, but it also indicates that Turkey has decided to shun the West. The EU is strictly against the death penalty and would immediately halt the decades-long drawn-out accession negotiations with Turkey as a result. Erdogan correctly calculated that the EU wants nothing to do with his country and that Turkey is unable to milk extra benefits from the bloc after the Brexit referendum, so he recalibrated his state’s foreign policy to align with the multipolar world instead. This saw the recent news of Turkey belatedly declaring Al Nusra a terrorist organization and opening up secret reconciliation talks with Syria, despite still repeating the “face saving” refrain of “Assad must go”. Furthermore, Turkey is part of Russia’s nascent coalition of regional powers opposed to the US’ daring attempt to militantly carve out the “second geopolitical Israel” of “Kurdistan”. Not only that, but Turkey are Russia are also back on track for reimplementing the Balkan Stream megaproject, which when paired with China’s complementary Balkan Silk Road high-speed rail project from Budapest to Piraeus, is perhaps the most ambitious multipolar outreach to Europe that has ever been attempted. The US stands to lose many of its strategic gains in the past decade if any of these multipolar counteroffensives succeed, let alone all of them, which is why it desperately masterminded this last-ditch attempt to safeguard its unipolar hegemony. Try as it might, though, it was patently obvious what the US was doing, and even Syria’s close Iranian ally – which many might otherwise think would have a relative interest in Erdogan’s downfall – voiced its support for Turkey’s “brave defense of democracy” via a tweet by Foreign Minister Zarif. Despite this statement being somewhat of an oxymoron, it proves that the Syrian government’s most active on-the-ground ally understands the greater interests at play here and is thus standing behind Erdogan (however shocking this might seem to many) because of the bigger picture that was just elaborated on above. As a closing forecast, it’s very likely that Turkey will accelerate its multipolar pivot and finally embrace its Eurasian destiny, though not without forthcoming American-improvised Hybrid War challenges – a renewed Kurdish insurgency, left-wing terrorism, a Color Revolution, Daesh attacks, maritime proxy hostility via Greece, engineered provocations with Turkey’s other neighbors, a civil war, and/or another feeble coup attempt — in order to throw the progressively Islamifying and Muslim Brotherhood-inspired state into such chaos that it becomes impossible for its new multipolar partners to make any substantial use of its territory in their joint quest to dismantle the unipolar world order.
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Post by pieter on Jul 19, 2016 11:53:56 GMT -7
Interesting text, which I read carefully and with interest. Thank you.
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Post by JustJohn or JJ on Jul 20, 2016 6:07:37 GMT -7
US Hints Turkey Might Be Expelled From NATO Over Crackdown on Coup Members22:03 18.07.2016 In the wake of Friday’s failed coup attempt in Turkey, the government launched a major crackdown on those accused of being involved. But the sweeping punishments are evidently a concern for Western allies. Over the weekend, the Turkish government arrested over 2,000 military personnel believed to be involved in the attempted coup. Additional orders have been given for over 8,000 police officers, civil servants, and regional governors to either step down or face arrest. The mass crackdown has evidently caused concern among Turkey’s key allies, with US Secretary of State John Kerry expressing concerns about Ankara’s lack of judicial due process. "We also firmly urge the government of Turkey to maintain calm and stability throughout the country, and we also urge the government of Turkey to uphold higher standards of respect for the nation’s democratic institutions and the rule of law," Kerry told reporters on Monday. "We will certainly support bringing the perpetrators of the coup to justice, but we also caution against a reach that goes well beyond that." Kerry went further, warning that Turkey’s actions could threaten its membership in the NATO alliance. "NATO also has a requirement with respect to democracy," he said. "Obviously a lot of people have been arrested, and arrested very quickly. The level of vigilance and scrutiny is obviously going to be significant in the days ahead. "Hopefully we can work in a constructive way that prevents a backsliding," Kerry said. Speaking to Sputnik, director of the Center on Peace and Liberty at the Independent Institute Ivan Eland suggested that political instability and an increasingly authoritarian rule in Turkey is "an embarrassment" to the alliance. "For the United States, whatever they say in public, the end goal is stability in Turkey. I don’t think they were happy about [Turkish President Recep Tayyip] Erdogan and his recent march towards authoritarianism," he said. "But the march towards authoritarianism is now probably going to accelerate, since the military is giving them an excuse to crack down. The US probably is torn, realizing it would be one form of autocracy or the other, and that would be an embarrassment to NATO, which is supposed to be an alliance of democracies." Damaged cars are seen next to an armored military vehicle in front of the police headquarters in Publicly, White House spokesman Josh Earnest also condemned Turkey’s crackdown. "It’s critical for them to exercise restraint, to respect and observe due process and to protect the freedoms that are enshrined in Turkey’s constitution," he said. The attempted coup left over 290 people dead and hundreds more injured. The Erdogan government blamed the attempt on Fethullah Gulen, a Turkish religious and political figure residing in the US. Ankara has called for his extradition, but Kerry stated that Washington has not received a formal request and so cannot respond to Ankara’s demands. Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu will travel to the US on Tuesday to discuss Gulen's possible extradition.
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Post by JustJohn or JJ on Jul 22, 2016 6:32:22 GMT -7
Secret Turkish intelligence source: Erdogan rebelled against NATO but won after taking control of nuclear bombsJuly 20, 2016 Komsomolskaya Pravda Exclusive Leonid Timoshin Translated from Russian by Kristina Kharlova While some insist that the attempt to topple Recep Tayyip Erdogan's - ambitious and bloody, was staged, others (primarily in Turkey) believe that the leader of their state almost lost his life due to rapprochement with Russia. An expert on the Middle East, head of Lev Gumilev Center, Pavel Zarifullin told "Komsomolskaya Pravda" what secret intel he received from Turkey from a local high-ranking and well-informed friends. Their information says one thing - the coup was prepared with the help of our overseas "partners". THE GOAL IS TO CONTROL - Pavel, who are these people - who gave you information from inside Turkey? In light of recent crackdown how do you keep in touch with them? - It is the elite of Turkish society, with whom I have been associated due to work for many years. Some of my colleagues were jailed by Erdogan back in 2007, but that's another story. Now I communicate with one of the famous Turkish professors, a consultant to local intelligence services. His name, of course, I will not disclose. He, like thousands of others, is walking on the edge - there is the same crackdown as in 1937 under Stalin. We correspond in a private chat room with coded messages. He is a supporter of Turkey's accession to the Eurasian Union, not the EU. And there are many influential people with similar views. Government, academia and those in security services have no doubt that the coup was prepared by Americans. Like all the previous ones in this country, since 1960. The military has always interfered in political process and acted in coordination with Americans. - What did he tell you? - Here's a quote: "The West, hoping to get control of the country through a military coup, as in Egypt, at first supported the coup. The putschists were not able to succeed without outside help. Only the West did not calculate that Turkish people do not accept any undemocratic process". Under the West he means primarily the United States. But it is possible that the Germans had a hand in this - they also pressured Erdogan. Don't forget, the Bundestag - the German Parliament - did not even recognize the genocide of Armenians by the Turks. TOO MANY DIFFERENCES - I don't understand why the US and Germany need this coup? - It is no secret. The main reason is rapprochement with Russia. Here's another quote from the correspondence with my source: "EU and NATO were unhappy with Turkey's rapprochement with Israel and Russia. The United States was irritated by the announcement in Turkey of Kurdish separatists in Syria being a terrorist organization while USA supported them. The positions of Ankara and Washington differed on Iraq and Syria. In dealing with refugee crisis the EU blamed Turkey, believing that it should block the flow of refugees at any cost." - That is the coup was overdue. From the outside. Is there information about how it was prepared? - The nucleus of the coup was the American Incirlik air force base in Turkey (located on the Mediterranean coast, a few hundred kilometers from the border with Syria, allows to control the Middle East. - Ed.). Chief of the base, Turkish General Bekir Ercan Van is now arrested (the base was also used for Turkish aircraft - after all the country is a member of NATO. - Ed.). All the main characters are from there. According to my insider information, the US Ambassador to Turkey John Bass (he had previously served in Georgia and there also conducted the anti-Russian policy) met several times with the former commander of the air force and the leader of the coup Akin Ozturk and the head of the base under the pretext of discussing relations with the Kurds in Syria and Iraq. The Turkish military - in general are mostly graduates of NATO military institutions, are pro-American. As interrogations show, the current conspirators, among whom were the top and the second echelon, received serious guarantees from the military and diplomatic leadership of the United States. They were promised asylum in the base in case of failure. THERE WERE HYDROGEN BOMBS - And were cheated? - No. But the Turks were ready to take the base by storm, but at the beginning just cut off power supply. But there were nuclear weapons stored! This has never happened before! Therefore, the Americans agreed not to interfere with arrests at the Turkish part of the base. Such unpublished information was passed on by our source. And the silly staging hypothesis is actively pushed just in the West. Even though just the number of dead and wounded (after a night of the coup 290 people are dead, nearly 1,500 wounded. - Ed.) shows how serious this is. - Is the opposition preacher Gulen, residing in USA, whose extradition is demanded by Erdogan, lying, he had nothing to do with it? - It is another American "column" which, of course, is also used. Here's what my source wrote in his last message (we talked on the night of July 20): "They (Putin and Erdogan. - Ed.) should meet as quickly as possible. Here everyone can't stop talking about this meeting. USA have done everything and are doing everything to prevent it. Including the coup so the leaders don't talk. We (the Eurasianists of Turkey. - Ed.) see the country's salvation in this meeting with Putin." I hope that repressions will not touch my expert, and he along with the other Turks will attend our Eurasian conference in Ankara immediately after the meeting of the presidents of Russia and Turkey. Today there is more and more talk about leaving NATO. Erdogan is better to go this route and become the Islamic Hugo Chavez. Otherwise he'll have to prepare for the next coup attempt. MILITARY EXPERT COMMENTARY Igor Korotchenko, chief editor of the magazine "National Defense": - I have no confidence to assert that the coup was prepared by the Americans. But the fact that they knew about it (taking into account the capabilities of the CIA and NSA) and were interested in it, that's for sure. Just they did not warn Erdogan, hoping that the victory of the coup will be good for them. The "Incirlik" base houses Americans and that means there are CIA employees. I have not been there myself and can't say about security and defense and how it is provided with backup power. But it is impossible to cut off power to our [Russian] air bases, even if you shut off electricity. Victor BARANETS, "KP" military observer: - According to various estimates, "Incirlik" airbase is home to up to 100 American nuclear bombs. Electricity is really needed to monitor the status of ammunition, for their protection. In the event of an accident diesel engines are automatically turned on. But they cannot operate indefinitely. If Americans were cut off from the fuel supply, there could be a very serious trouble. Despite the fact that the base commander was a Turk, he gave the order to shut off only the Turkish part of "Incirlik". You have to understand that it houses American and Turkish aircraft, and during operations there are planes from the UK, Germany, Saudi Arabia, Qatar. However, at the time of the coup they were not there. Let me remind you that the commander of the base, Turkish General Van asked for asylum in the United States but was refused. If he was granted asylum, it would immediately become obvious that the US is somehow sympathetic to the coup, and maybe had a hand in this. However, when the arrests were carried out in the Turkish part of the base, the flights resumed, electricity was reinstated to the Turkish part of the airbase, and the base began to function normally.
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Post by karl on Jul 22, 2016 7:09:32 GMT -7
For the present, at least perhaps, the situation has stabilized for now to provide for diplomatic solutions to begin.
Although the importance of the base is highly valued by the Americans, means this is not the only location in this known world to establish such a base for this intended purpose. The Incirlik base was established for shared use some years in past much earlier then to fight such groups as the IS. But to the Americans, a static land base is much more cost effective then the use of Carrier ships that are very expensive to operate and, if lost or damaged, then becomes very very expensive commensurately to replace.
Rather or not Turkey to leave NATO is a mute question that remains to be answered as time progresses. It is the matter of Nuclear weapons and material that is a question of reasonable actions to place these sensitive materials in a location that has a question of stability that has not been reasonably demonstrated by the currant Turkish Government.
In as far as the question of Turkey to leave NATO. Perhaps it will not matter after the American November election. For one of the presidential candidates has stated that the American Government will remove their part of NATO membership. If so, this will most likely be the end of NATO and up to the EU to establish a consolidation of EU membership into a coalition of representation and better control as the headquarters in Europe in the stead of The US.
Karl
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Post by pieter on Jul 22, 2016 9:48:01 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Jul 22, 2016 10:21:21 GMT -7
2016 Turkish purgesTurkish President Erdogan is set to turn Turkey into a de facto dictatorship, as over 20,000 personnel across the country have been illegally detained following Friday’s failed Coup attempt. Political purges of the judicial, police, educational and other sectors of the Turkish civil service and military are ongoing, following the 2016 Turkish coup d'état attempt during the presidency of Recep Tayyip Erdoğan. Starting on 16 July 2016, 2,745 judges were dismissed and detained. By 20 July 2016, about 50,000 officials had been dismissed, detained or suspended. This took place in the context of a temporary suspension of the European Convention on Human Rights and indications that the death penalty, abolished in 2004, might be reintroduced. President Recep Tayyip ErdoğanIn January 2014, during a major corruption enquiry in Turkey, 96 judges and prosecutors, including the chief prosecutor of Izmir, Huseyin Bas, were transferred to new locations, causing investigations into corruption to cease. Bas was transferred to Samsun. Altogether 120 judges and prosecutors were reassigned. At the time, The Daily Telegraph described the events as " the biggest purge of the judiciary in [Turkey's] history". From 2014 to mid-2016, repeated purges of civilian, military and judicial officials took place in Turkey, mainly aimed at followers of Fethullah Gülen, a former colleague of the Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdoğan. Chief prosecutor of Izmir, Huseyin BasJuly 2016 purgesIn the wake of the coup attempt's failure, during the first post-coup speech Erdoğan could address to the nation upon landing at Atatürk airport, he called the coup a " gift of God" as it would allow him to " cleanse" the army of the Gülen " virus" and create a " new Turkey". Fethullah GülenAn extensive purge of the Turkish civil service began in the wake of the 2016 Turkish coup d'état attempt, with President Erdoğan warning his opponents that " they will pay a heavy price for this." The New York Times described the purges as a " counter-coup" and expected the president to " become more vengeful and obsessed with control than ever, exploiting the crisis not just to punish mutinous soldiers but to further quash whatever dissent is left in Turkey". After protesters chanted for the reintroduction of the death penalty, previously abolished by Turkey in 2004, Erdoğan indicated that this was a possibility that would be discussed in parliament, and that in a democracy, the will of the people must be respected. On 21 July, the Turkish government announced that they would suspend the European Convention on Human Rights during a temporary state of emergency. On 18 July, U.S. State Secretary John Kerry urged Turkish authorities to halt the increasing crackdown on its citizens, indicating that the crackdown was meant to " suppress dissent". French Foreign Minister Jean-Marc Ayrault voiced concern, warning against a " political system which turns away from democracy" in response to the purges. The United Nations have been accused of being thus far unresponsive against purges that have involved large numbers of people from a variety of social ranks, while at the same time also failing to condemn the coup and resulting violence due to Egypt's veto against a resolution in that direction. MilitaryPrime Minister Binali Yıldırım announced on 16 July 2016 that 2,839 soldiers of various ranks had been arrested. Among those arrested were at least 34 generals or admirals. A number of students of the Kuleli Military High School, enough to fill five buses, were also arrested. By 18 July 2016, a total of 103 generals and admirals have been detained by Turkish authorities in connection with the coup. Yasemin Özata Çetinkaya, the governor of Sinop Province, was removed from her duty and her husband, a colonel in the Turkish army, arrested. Turkish military conducted a raid on the Turkish Air Force Academy in Istanbul as well. Police and judiciaryOn 16 July 2016, the Supreme Board of Judges and Prosecutors of Turkey (HSYK) removed 2,745 Turkish judges from duty and ordered their detention. Of these judges, 541 were in administrative judiciary and 2,204 were in criminal judiciary. This amounted to approximately 36% of all judges in Turkey at the time. Two judges from the Constitutional Court of Turkey, Alparslan Altan and Erdal Tercan, were detained by Turkish authorities for supposed ties with the Gülen movement, while 5 members of the HSYK had their membership revoked and 10 members of the Turkish Council of State were arrested on charges of being members of the parallel state. Furthermore, arrest warrants were issued for 48 members of the Council of State and 140 members of the Court of Cassation. T he Supreme Board of Judges and Prosecutors of TurkeyBy 18 July 2016, the Turkish government had suspended 8,777 government officials across the country for alleged links to the coup perpetrators. Among those suspended include 7,899 police officers, 614 gendarmerie officers, 47 district governors and 30 regional governors. As of 19 July 2016, 755 judges and prosecutors had been arrested in relation to the coup attempt. Turkish Police Arrest Over 100 Judges, Prosecutors Amid Post-Coup PurgeCivil serviceFollowing a series of arrests and purges throughout the government, Prime Minister Yıldırım announced on 18 July 2016 that annual leave for all civil servants was suspended, and all those on leave were to return to work. Over three million civil servants were affected. In addition, public sector employees were banned from leaving the country. Turkish Prime Minister YıldırımDeputy Mayor of Istanbul's Şişli District, Cemil Candaş, was shot in the head in his office by an unidentified assailant on 18 July 2016. Meanwhile, Turkish parliament was evacuated due to unidentified security concerns. The murdered Deputy Mayor of Istanbul's Şişli District, Cemil CandaşBy the evening of 19 July, the number of public sector employees suspended had reached 49,321. In the Ministry of Finance, more than 1500 employees were suspended. In the Prime Ministry, 257 employees, including six advisers, were suspended. The Presidency of Religious Affairs suspended 492 employees, among them three provincial muftis. The numbers of suspended personnel in the National Intelligence Organization and Ministry of Family and Social Policy were 100 and 393 respectively. On 20 July 2016, the Youth and Sports Minister Akif Çağatay Kılıç announced that 245 personnel within his ministry had been laid off. The Energy Ministry reports 300 employees were let go, and the Customs Ministry indicated 184 employees were dismissed. Sports Minister Akif Çağatay KılıçEducationBy far the greatest purge was in the Ministry of National Education, where 15,200 teachers were suspended. The licenses of 21,000 teachers in the private sector were also cancelled. The Council of Higher Education asked all deans of state and private universities, numbering 1577, to resign. 626 educational institutions, mostly private, were shut down. Turkish post-coup purges sweep through education as thousands of teachers lose their jobsOn 20 July, in Burdur, one school, one cram school and four student hostels were shut down. In addition, a travel ban was placed on academics, preventing them from leaving the country. Growing discontent: A Turkish protester holds up a placard with pictures of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan (left) and cleric Fethullah Gulen with the slogan 'We will cast them down' during a demonstration against corruption in Istanbul in december 2013. | AFP-JIJIMediaThe licenses of 24 radio and television channels and the press cards of 34 journalists accused of being linked to Gülen were revoked. Two people were arrested for praising the coup attempt and insulting President Erdoğan on social media. Notable peopleHüseyin Avni Mutlu, former governor of İstanbul, was dismissed on 19 July 2016. Hüseyin Avni Mutlu former governor of İstanbulSpokesmen of the Erdoğan government, including the president himself, have repeatedly requested the extradition of Fethullah Gülen, allegedly responsible, according to Turkey, for inspiring or organizing the coup from the United States. Prime Minister Binali Yıldırım stated that any country standing by Gülen would be considered an enemy of Turkey. After the initial demands, the US had denied receiving any formal extradition request; one was later officially submitted, and the US is committed to evaluating it. ResponsesHuman Rights Watch warned the Turkish government against "[using] the coup attempt to justify a witch-hunt against those it regards as opponents". ConclusionLike Leonid Timoshin from Komsomolskaya Pravda says, inside Turkey the same kind of crackdown as in 1937 under Stalin is taking place. Like during the purges in the SovjetUnion in the late thirties, high ranking officers, generals, colonels and majors are arrested, but also lower ranking officers, capitains and lieutenants. Soldiers, pilots, army staff. But worse also teachers, docents, university deans (faculty heads), university professors, school counselors, administrators of universities, scientists and scientific researchers, journalists, judges, civil servants, police officers, intelligentsia members, artists, writers, and opposition figures in general. Minorities like Kurds, Kemalist secularists, Alevi's, Armenians, ethnic Turkish christians, Georgians and Turkish jews will have difficult times. Everyone who isn't Turkish Sunni Muslim and Pro-Erdogan is suspect nowadays. The situation inside Turkey and in the Turkish communities in Western-Europe (the Netherlands, Belgium and Germany) is very, very serious. The situation is very tense, heated and explosive. There is a lot of intimidation, hate mail, threats and verbal aggression within the Turkish community in the Netherlands I heard from Turks and heard Turkish public figures say on Dutch television. The Turkish community is very polarised and torn apart. Government supporters wave Turkish flags and shout slogans during a protest in Taksim Square, Istanbul, Tuesday The Turkish government accelerated its crackdown on alleged plotters of the failed coup against President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. | APBBC source 20 July 2016:Who is being purged?The purge is so extensive that few believe it was not already planned. And there seems little chance that everyone on the list is a Gulenist. The sheer numbers are sobering. Some 9,000 people are in custody and many more are out of a job. Although accurate details are difficult to come by, this is the current list: - 7,500 soldiers have been detained, including 118 generals and admirals- 8,000 police have been removed from their posts and 1,000 arrested- 3,000 members of the judiciary, including 1,481 judges, have been suspended- 15,200 education ministry officials have lost their jobs- 21,000 private school teachers have had their licences revoked- 1,577 university deans (faculty heads) have been asked to resign- 1,500 finance ministry staff have been removed- 492 clerics, preachers and religious teachers have been fired- 393 social policy ministry staff have been dismissed- 257 prime minister's office staff have been removed- 100 intelligence officials have been suspendedThe list may be incomplete because the situation is constantly changing. But it is clear that the purge has affected well over 58,000 people.
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Post by karl on Jul 22, 2016 12:57:44 GMT -7
Who is being purged?
The purge is so extensive that few believe it was not already planned. And there seems little chance that everyone on the list is a Gulenist. The sheer numbers are sobering. Some 9,000 people are in custody and many more are out of a job. Although accurate details are difficult to come by, this is the current list: - 7,500 soldiers have been detained, including 118 generals and admirals - 8,000 police have been removed from their posts and 1,000 arrested - 3,000 members of the judiciary, including 1,481 judges, have been suspended - 15,200 education ministry officials have lost their jobs - 21,000 private school teachers have had their licences revoked - 1,577 university deans (faculty heads) have been asked to resign - 1,500 finance ministry staff have been removed - 492 clerics, preachers and religious teachers have been fired - 393 social policy ministry staff have been dismissed - 257 prime minister's office staff have been removed - 100 intelligence officials have been suspended
This is very impressive and demonstrates efficiency in operation and results. What better way to gain and keep most every one very loyal to their government. But then, one must remember that these same people are those that through free democratic election, voted Erdogan into power.
Karl
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Post by pieter on Jul 22, 2016 16:12:26 GMT -7
Who is being purged? The purge is so extensive that few believe it was not already planned. And there seems little chance that everyone on the list is a Gulenist. The sheer numbers are sobering. Some 9,000 people are in custody and many more are out of a job. Although accurate details are difficult to come by, this is the current list: - 7,500 soldiers have been detained, including 118 generals and admirals - 8,000 police have been removed from their posts and 1,000 arrested - 3,000 members of the judiciary, including 1,481 judges, have been suspended - 15,200 education ministry officials have lost their jobs - 21,000 private school teachers have had their licences revoked - 1,577 university deans (faculty heads) have been asked to resign - 1,500 finance ministry staff have been removed - 492 clerics, preachers and religious teachers have been fired - 393 social policy ministry staff have been dismissed - 257 prime minister's office staff have been removed - 100 intelligence officials have been suspended This is very impressive and demonstrates efficiency in operation and results. What better way to gain and keep most every one very loyal to their government. But then, one must remember that these same people are those that through free democratic election, voted Erdogan into power. Karl Dear Karl, In my humble opinion (after contacts with Turkish people and Kurds and Dutch journalists and politicians) the people who are being purged or put under pressure is anyone who is not in the camp of Erdogans AK party. It seems that the present acting Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, the present Turkish prime minister Binali Yıldırım, the AK party itself as dominant organisation and movement in Turkey (it's machine, functionaries, politicians and activists), AK party supporters and the former AK party president and prime minister, Abdullah Gül and Ahmet Davutoğlu, are all very agitated, active and persistent in getting full control over the Turkish state, the Turkish nation, the Turkish people and even the Turkish diaspora abroad. The former prime minister and president of Turkey Ahmet Davutoğlu and Abdullah Gül, who put their support behind the AK party and Recep Tayyip Erdoğan last weekThe fpresent prime minister and president of Turkey Binali Yıldırım and Recep Tayyip ErdoğanPeople with the Turkish national flags gather outside the military headquarters in Ankara, Turkey.The attempted coup 'd etat was a shock experience for supporters and oponents of Recep Tayyip Erdoğan. I have seen terrible scenes Karl, which I will not show over here, because enough terrible things have been shown and discussed over here. I saw Turkish tanks, past weekend, who deliberately drove over cars on a Turkish highway in which people were stuck in a traffic jam. The tanks drove over private peoples cars while these people were still inside them, crushing them to their deaths. I also saw another gruesome scene of Turkish tanks driving over Turkish pedestrians who couldn't escape in time, splitting people open like butchered meat, leaving a pile of flesh, bloo, bones and body parts in the streets. From the air Apache combat helicopters shot with heavy machine guns and rockets at armoured police vehicles and civilian cars, busses and crowds. Airplanes flew over in low altitude to intimidate people on the ground in Ankara and Istanbul. And that killing, wounding and traumatizing people was all in vain, because they prepared their Coup 'd etat very poorly. Was it purpose that this coup would fail and that these people would die and many people would be wounded so that the powers that be could get more full control. Conspiracy theories from various kinds circulate. Erdogan would be behind the coup himself? A fraction of the Army (anti-Erdogan and his AK party, fierce secularist Kemalists) would have had help of foreign powers to reconstruct the strict secular state based on Atatürks secularist ideology. The third conspiracy theory is that Muhammed Fethullah Gülen and his liberal Islamic transnational religious and social movement, The Gülen movement, would be behind the attempted coup, in which officers of the Turksih army would have had cooperated with the Turkish judiciary, Turkish intellectuals from the universities (the scientists, professors and university administrators), Turkish journalists and others. Turkey and the Turkish diaspora is full of unrest, distrust, polarization, discord, infighting, fear, anxiety, sadness, disbelief, somberness and pessimism about the Turkish near future. A sad affect of the past decade of AK party rule and the coup 'd etat of last weekend is the fact that the Turks in our mids are uneasy about themselves, that they don't trust compatriots and look with great suspicion at other Turks in our Dutch, German, Danish and Turkish societies. Nobody gains from the present situation. Not the Turks themselves, not the Kurds, not the Turkish diaspora, not the allies and friends of the Turks and not even the enemies of the Turks. The situation is very vulnerable, fragile, dangerous and uncertain. It is very bad that the army is weakened in a time that Turkey faces multiple challanges and threats from inside and outside. A weakened army is not good in the combat against ISIS in Turkey, and in neighboring Syria and Iraq. Both ISIS and the radical Marxist Leninist/leftwing nationalist PKK can gain ground in Turkey today. And that is not in the interest of the ethnic Turks nor in the interest of the large Kurd minority in Turkey. It is sad that on of the few good things the AK party managed to do and that is economical growth will be deminished or decreasing by the authoritatian and totalitarian measures and by the continuing terror threat and actual terrorism which will continuie on Turkish soil. Turkey for decades was on of the few Pro-Western, secular (Kemalist) and half European Muslim nations. Today we will throw that away and leave Turkey to islamism, extremism and ultra-nationalist great Ottoman Turkism? It is bad, very bad what is taking place in Turkey right now, and we will have to face the consequences of that in Germany and the Netherlands. I will assure you the Erdogan and Gülen people will clash in our nations. And in that conflict sooner or later the Kurds will take sides or will react if they are provoked or persecuted inside and outside Turkey. Kurd where they form a minority in Turkish diaspora communities abroad are provoked, intimidated and harassed by Nationalistic Ethnic Sunni Muslim Turks with ultra-Nationalistic Turkish nationalist ideas and convictions. Fro them Kurds are mountain Turks and should'nt be allowed to speak Kurd and have their Kurd culture. Turkey is more pluriform, diverse and multi-ethnic than many Europeans and Americans realise. Next to the ethnic Sunni Muslim Turks you have Kurds, Alevi's, Shia Muslim Turks, Georgians, Greeks, Armenians (Armenian is a swearword in Turkish by the way today), jews, Albanians, Arabs, Assyrians, Azeris, Bosniaks, Circassians, Lazs, Persians (Shia Muslim minority), Pomaks (Bulgarians), Yazidis and Roma. And within then ethnic Turks you have a large diversity of religious, political, cultural, social (milieu), philosophical and educational levels, groups, ideas and convictions. Cheers, Pieter
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Post by karl on Jul 22, 2016 17:39:19 GMT -7
Pieter
Thank you for your very explicit reply, for in light of this situation, my self was hoping you would do so and in your professional manner, to describe the reality of this situation.
My post you have replyed to and added with your excellent manner is very correct, for the brutality is evident and present in suppression of any opposition to the present government of Erdogan. I meant not to appear heartless and with out sense of feelings for the pain of others, this was not my intent what so ever. But the media appears to wish to save such sights from what the public needs to know and understand what is occurring and at what cost to human suffering. It is similar to human bombs with the effects and what happens to the body of the bomber with body parts flying about and the upper portion generally entact but blown some distance away. This should be shown and known by those individuals committing them selves to this act of blowing them selves up. For there is no glory to this act as it is an instrument to murder other people by. These people will not see glorification of any sort, but simply nothingness at the moment of detonation, for that is reality without the emagination of religious beliefs.
The only additional comment my self may make in this regard to numerious arrest under the name of Erdogan is: It is very similar to a firm with too many emplyees, to lay off the most of them, and then rehire those it wishes to keep. For as with Erdogan, those released to return to their respective work and duties, will be the ones most trusted and loyal to not the state of Turkey, but to him personally. It is a method most dectators use to gain and maintain their power over the will of others.
Karl
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Post by JustJohn or JJ on Jul 24, 2016 3:40:37 GMT -7
Turexit: Will Turkey Leave NATO Over Post-Coup Attempt Rift with the US?
03:06 24.07.2016
With polls showing that only 17% of Turks welcome the US in their country and with the country's leadership accusing the United States of staging the attempted government overthrow and even threatening war against the Americans, this relationship appears doomed to fail.
The death of NATO appeared to be all but written on the wall in the wake of the failed coup attempt when Turkish Labor Secretary Suleyman Soylu said during a live interview with Haberturk television that "The US is behind the coup" – a statement that Ankara still refuses to condemn.
The situation became worse as the country’s provocative President Recep Tayyip Erdogan demanded that the US extradite the "head of terrorist" referring to US-based cleric Fethullah Gulen, who Ankara claims was behind the failed government overthrow effort while the crowd sang "death penalty for Feto"
But it was Prime Minister Binali Yidlirim who really lowered the boom threatening to go to war with "any" country that supports Fethullah Gulen – a direct reference to the United States.
Since accusing the United States, their long-time ally, of masterminding a failed attempt to overthrow a government whose connections to Islamic terrorist organizations – with evidence showing that Ankara has been engaged in regular weapons and oil trade with Daesh and reports connecting the Erdogan regime with a false-flag sarin gas attack in Syria – already much too close for Washington’s liking many believed that the United States would pack up and leave.
Instead, the US State Department has cautioned that accusing the United States of attempting to overthrow an allied government is "harmful to bilateral relations," expressing continued support for the Erdogan regime, and has attempted to explain to Turkey that under US law evidence is needed to support the extradition request Turkey seeks.
The final straw may very well have come several months ago with the attacks against three US marines in Istanbul on Wednesday by a group of Turkish nationalists who will no doubt be emboldened by their leaders’ statements that the Americans were behind the attempt to destabilize the country. The attackers put white hoods and bags over the heads of the US soldiers while yelling “Yankees go home” while calling them "murderers" and throwing orange paint on them.
"Because we regard you as murderers who kill men, we require that you leave our country," one of the Turks said in English while the soldiers were chased down the street. Despite the Obama administration’s attempts to downplay this growing sentiment among the Turkish people, a poll in October revealed that only 19% of Turks welcome Americans.
Washington now faces a critical challenge with Turkey serving as the linchpin to America’s security strategy in the Middle East and the Balkans based on its geography and longstanding alliance with the United States.
NATO Supreme Allied Commander James Stavridis explained in a recent Foreign Policy magazine article that Turkey has been critical to "virtually every NATO operation with significant impact: training Afghan Security Forces and leading coalition efforts in the central district, including Kabul; sending ships and aircraft to Libya; participating in counterpiracy operations; maintaining a steady presence in the security and peacekeeping force in the Balkans."
Despite its strategic importance, Ankara has increasingly become a thorn in the side of the Obama administration and NATO which houses some 90 tactical nuclear weapons at Incirlik Airbase only 60 miles northwest of the Syrian border with growing political instability raising the prospect of a "loose nuke" falling into the hands of Daesh terrorists.
That possibility looms large as the Erdogan regime engages in a full-scale purge of opposition having locked up over 10,000 alleged supporters of Fethullah Gulen from the country’s education, judicial, and military sectors while hinting at the idea of bringing back the death penalty to engage in mass executions by saying earlier this week "why should I keep them locked up and feed them."
Washington now faces a conundrum of setting back its defense strategy a decade by losing access to a critical regional base or enduring repeated accusations that it attempted a coup against its ally, attacks on US soldiers by an increasingly hostile Turkish population, the threat of weapons of mass destruction falling into the waiting arms of terrorists, and sanctioning the activities of a leader who has hinted at killing off over 10,000 people on allegations of treason.
It may ultimately not be Turkey that leaves NATO, but rather the West that decides Ankara has drifted too far down the road of perdition. One way or another, the clock appears to be ticking on the waning hours of the once great military alliance.
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Post by JustJohn or JJ on Aug 1, 2016 6:49:10 GMT -7
Turexit: Will Turkey Leave NATO Over Post-Coup Attempt Rift with the US?03:06 24.07.2016 With polls showing that only 17% of Turks welcome the US in their country and with the country's leadership accusing the United States of staging the attempted government overthrow and even threatening war against the Americans, this relationship appears doomed to fail. The death of NATO appeared to be all but written on the wall in the wake of the failed coup attempt when Turkish Labor Secretary Suleyman Soylu said during a live interview with Haberturk television that "The US is behind the coup" – a statement that Ankara still refuses to condemn. The situation became worse as the country’s provocative President Recep Tayyip Erdogan demanded that the US extradite the "head of terrorist" referring to US-based cleric Fethullah Gulen, who Ankara claims was behind the failed government overthrow effort while the crowd sang "death penalty for Feto" But it was Prime Minister Binali Yidlirim who really lowered the boom threatening to go to war with "any" country that supports Fethullah Gulen – a direct reference to the United States. Since accusing the United States, their long-time ally, of masterminding a failed attempt to overthrow a government whose connections to Islamic terrorist organizations – with evidence showing that Ankara has been engaged in regular weapons and oil trade with Daesh and reports connecting the Erdogan regime with a false-flag sarin gas attack in Syria – already much too close for Washington’s liking many believed that the United States would pack up and leave. Instead, the US State Department has cautioned that accusing the United States of attempting to overthrow an allied government is "harmful to bilateral relations," expressing continued support for the Erdogan regime, and has attempted to explain to Turkey that under US law evidence is needed to support the extradition request Turkey seeks. The final straw may very well have come several months ago with the attacks against three US marines in Istanbul on Wednesday by a group of Turkish nationalists who will no doubt be emboldened by their leaders’ statements that the Americans were behind the attempt to destabilize the country. The attackers put white hoods and bags over the heads of the US soldiers while yelling “Yankees go home” while calling them "murderers" and throwing orange paint on them. "Because we regard you as murderers who kill men, we require that you leave our country," one of the Turks said in English while the soldiers were chased down the street. Despite the Obama administration’s attempts to downplay this growing sentiment among the Turkish people, a poll in October revealed that only 19% of Turks welcome Americans. Washington now faces a critical challenge with Turkey serving as the linchpin to America’s security strategy in the Middle East and the Balkans based on its geography and longstanding alliance with the United States. NATO Supreme Allied Commander James Stavridis explained in a recent Foreign Policy magazine article that Turkey has been critical to "virtually every NATO operation with significant impact: training Afghan Security Forces and leading coalition efforts in the central district, including Kabul; sending ships and aircraft to Libya; participating in counterpiracy operations; maintaining a steady presence in the security and peacekeeping force in the Balkans." Despite its strategic importance, Ankara has increasingly become a thorn in the side of the Obama administration and NATO which houses some 90 tactical nuclear weapons at Incirlik Airbase only 60 miles northwest of the Syrian border with growing political instability raising the prospect of a "loose nuke" falling into the hands of Daesh terrorists. That possibility looms large as the Erdogan regime engages in a full-scale purge of opposition having locked up over 10,000 alleged supporters of Fethullah Gulen from the country’s education, judicial, and military sectors while hinting at the idea of bringing back the death penalty to engage in mass executions by saying earlier this week "why should I keep them locked up and feed them." Washington now faces a conundrum of setting back its defense strategy a decade by losing access to a critical regional base or enduring repeated accusations that it attempted a coup against its ally, attacks on US soldiers by an increasingly hostile Turkish population, the threat of weapons of mass destruction falling into the waiting arms of terrorists, and sanctioning the activities of a leader who has hinted at killing off over 10,000 people on allegations of treason. It may ultimately not be Turkey that leaves NATO, but rather the West that decides Ankara has drifted too far down the road of perdition. One way or another, the clock appears to be ticking on the waning hours of the once great military alliance. ‘Not Our Friends’: Erdogan Stokes Anti-US, Anti-NATO Fervor in TurkeyMiddle East 22:00 30.07.2016(updated 04:58 31.07.2016) Get short URL NATO finds itself in quite the predicament as one of its most important strategic partners continues to accuse the United States of aiding and sympathizing with Gulenists who attempted to overthrow the Erdogan government. On Friday, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan condemned West for refusing to show solidarity with Ankara in the wake of a failed attempt to overthrow the government saying that NATO 'allies' that are more concerned about the fate of coup supporters than the survival of Turkey are not friends of Ankara. US Army General Joseph Votel testifies during a Senate Armed Services Committee hearing on Votel’s nomination to be commander of the U.S. Central Command on Capitol Hill in Washington March 9, 2016. Erdogan blasted the West for criticizing the massive purge of Turkey’s military and other state institutions which has seen 60,000 people detained, removed or suspended over suspected links with the coup and for cancelling 50,000 civilian passports which many worry is but a prelude to an expansion of the reign of terror inside the country. "The attitude of many countries and their officials over the coup attempt in Turkey is shameful in the name of democracy," Erdogan told hundreds of supporters at the presidential palace in Ankara. "Any country and any leader who does not worry about the life of Turkish people and our democracy as much as they worry about the fate of coupists are not our friends," said Erdogan, who narrowly escaped capture and perhaps death on the night of the coup. The statements come in response to US National Intelligence Director James Clapper’s statement on Thursday that the purges were harming the fight against Daesh in Syria and Iraq by stripping away key Turkish officers who had worked closely with the United States. Comments made at Erdogan’s rally on Friday follow remarks made earlier in the day blasting four-star US General and CENTCOM commander Joseph Votel for criticizing Turkey’s post-coup attempt purge saying "Who are you? Know your place." Erdogan went on to hint once more that the United States planned the failed government overthrow bid. "My people know who is behind this scheme… they know who the superior intelligence behind it is, and with these statements you are revealing yourselves, you are giving yourselves away." The remarks come at a troubling time only one day after over 5,000 protesters yelling "death to the US" marched towards NATO’s critical Incirlik Air Base which houses between 50 and 90 US tactical nuclear weapons before security officials successfully dispersed the raging demonstrators. Last Sunday, a massive fire broke out near another key NATO base in Izmir with T24 News reporting that officials suspected “anti-American sabotage” as the cause of the blaze. The incident occurred only hours after leading pro-Erdogan Islamist newspaper Yani Safek posted the picture of another top US General, Commander of NATO’s International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) John F. Campbell, under the headline “The Man Behind the Failed Coup in Turkey.” In the wake of the failed coup bid, Turkey’s Labor Minister Suleyman Soylu rushed for a live interview with HaberTurk to say that “the US is behind the coup” and only hours after the State Department condemned this statement as "harmful to bilateral relations" the country’s Prime Minister Binali Yildirim accused the United States of harboring alleged coup mastermind Fethullah Gulen and said Turkey would go to war with "any" country that sides with the Pennsylvania-based cleric. Marine Corps General Joseph Dunford testifies during the Senate Armed Services committee nomination hearing to be chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff on Capitol Hill in Washington, July 9, 2015 As the United States relationship with Ankara in tatters forcing Washington to imagine the implications of Turkey potentially abandoning NATO, if the US isn’t forced to demand their eviction before that, US General Joseph Dunford, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, rushed to Ankara on Friday to attempt to quell tensions. However, with polls before the failed coup showing that only 17% of Turks welcome the United States in the country and with the Erdogan regime’s flippant willingness to accuse Washington of plotting a coup against, festering anti-Western sentiments threaten to explode in Turkey at any time and analysts wonder if the Turkish President will, or even can, put the genie back in the bottle.
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Post by karl on Aug 1, 2016 8:15:40 GMT -7
J.J.
Interesting series of presentations dealing with foreign policy. It is apparent by failed results, the American CIA has failed in it mission once again by virtue of results. In that business, failure is not an option favourable results are the goal.
Each nation though, has its priorities in as well as the American one as indicated by the failure in the over throw of the present Erdogan government. Who knows for sure what their aim was to replace the old government with a new one for it is a question that perhaps they were not sure in the case they succeeded.
For the Chancellors office, the goal was/is to keep all options open with the Erdogan Government as a solution to the Islamic refugee crises in Europe. For Mr. Erdogan, payment for services rendered is very well appreciated and he apparently enjoys to fill his pocket with it. If though he so chooses, he could open the gates for a flood of such people into Europe with not very favourable results.
It would be a good thing if he {Erdogan} were to insure Turkish presence in NATO, for they have certainly served well in past and present in the missions they have provided for. If they leave, the sun will still rise and the moon will not leave the night sky.
What is important, is trade relations, for Turkey has been a good trade partner for many years and this has been a good relationship in the manner of fair trade.
What though is the stye in the eye of some, is Turkey is the protector of the only entrance and exit from the Black Sea. If to control the Turkish government, then control would be of any and all shipping traffic into and out of the black sea, this would enclude the Russian Black sea fleet. And, a good reason for American control of Turkey, to then hold the reins of power in what ever crosses the mind of the Americans as to the Russians over their fleet.
There is a reason for most every thing, the issue is to determine what the reason is, and, who will be effecte.
Karl
Karl
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