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Post by Jaga on May 11, 2019 21:23:44 GMT -7
There are a couple of Polish families, probably your age group that came here to work in the INL as scientists. Some people have mixed origin - like a lady who was born in Poland but lived a majority of her life in Germany and now in the US. Whe decided to go to POland this year, partly thanks to making friends with a Polish lady who visited me. I also meet some people from all over the world in sport club where I go for yoga. Today I went walking with my Japanese friend. Majority of people in eastern Idaho are LDS people of Scandinavian descent, but in our Catholic Church we have more and more latinos. There are very few blacks in Idaho, much more in Texas or in DC. Jaga,
Jaga, do you have Poles, Czechs, Slovaks, other Germans (than your husband John), Russians, Ukrainians, Belarussians, Slovenians, Serbs, Croats, Montenegrins, Macedonians, Bulgarians, Hungarians, Romanians, Bulgarians, Baltic people, Georgians or Armenians in your environment,or are the people in Idaho mainly Anglo-Saxon Mormoms, WASPS (White Anglo Saxon Protestants and thus people of English, Scottish, Welsh, Northern-Irish, and Americans of German and Scandinavian descent? Plus the small black, and latino minorities.
How is the ethnic mix in your Alaska Kai, do you have a lot of Slavic people over there or is it a more a WASP state?
How about your places John, Jeanne, Ludiwk, Eric and others?
Cheers, Pieter
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Post by Jaga on May 11, 2019 21:28:13 GMT -7
Kai When I went to Poprad first time in my life I was maybe 7-8 years old. There was so called "small border" for Poles and people from Czechoslovakia who just wanted to visit the near border region, we did not need even a passport. We just drove a bus to the boarder, then went throught the boarder control on feet (therefore we were checked more than people in the bus) and then took a Slovak bus and eventually ended up in Poprad. Zakopane is one of my least favorite places nowadays. It is too comercial, expensive and just a headache to get to and out. Kaima, . Was your bus journey from Krakow to the Poprad a bit troublesome due to road conditions, geographical (mountain) conditions or due to the way Poles and Slovaks drive (Behave in traffic) or was it a combination of these factors?
Cheers, Pieter I can almost say I was in a grumpy mood, with only the inconvenient bus schedule to complain about. Connections were not good, I was 'stuck' in Zakopane for 4 or 5 hours and had to figure out which bus lane the right bus came to, and managed that more or less at the last minute. A large part of that is the manly tendency not to ask directions. More of the grumpy side, I had foolishly expected a small alpine village, but of course Zakopane is a large tourist center, simply because so many tourists like me come and demand service, which the Poles are famous for happily providing! I admire their business sense. They are willing to provide services requested and charge a fair price, relatively cheap by US standards. In some other formerly communist countries the free enterprise spirit was tampened down or lost with the two generations of oppression. In Poland they kept the spirit alive, and it serves tourists and residents well (they can earn a living!).
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Post by Jaga on May 11, 2019 21:41:17 GMT -7
Pieter, some of these language vidoes are very nice and well done. Thanks. I liked especially comparing the whole phrases in different languages
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Post by pieter on May 12, 2019 14:19:01 GMT -7
Jaga,
It is nice and good that these Poles work for the Idaho National Laboratory. It is good for you that there are a few Polish families in your environment Jaga.
Nice that this Polish lady visited you. I hope for you that she lives nearby and that you could meet more often. This sportclub with your Yogo lessons and international members must be great for you, because you wrote that your parents house was always attended by international guests.
In Europe in the Netherlands we have a view of Norwegian and Swedish people as rather reserved, cold, distant in their behavior and self centered. That is what I heard of travelers to these lands.
In Idaho these people of Scandinavian descent who were born and raised in the American culture and the rather sectarian and strict LDS faith must be very different from the people you knew in Poland and Texas.
When I see the differences between West-European people on one side and Central-European and Eastern-European people on the other side I can imagine your difficulties with the LDS majority in your part of Idaho.
I always hope that on the long term peoples and cultures will learn each others culture, will be interested in ‘the other’ and accept and thus tolerate the other.
In the Netherlands we need Central- and Eastern-European workers and therefor we will have to accept them, tolerate them and welcome them.
Agriculture, some industries and construction firms need them. And we have to accommodate them better, because their living conditions in the Netherlands are terrible.
Cheers, Pieter
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Post by pieter on May 12, 2019 14:22:02 GMT -7
Thank you for your description of your travel to Poprad. Were there large differences between Poland and Slovakia (which was part of Czechoslovakia back then) in your opinion Jaga?
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Post by kaima on May 12, 2019 22:14:55 GMT -7
Thank you for your description of your travel to Poprad. Were there large differences between Poland and Slovakia (which was part of Czechoslovakia back then) in your opinion Jaga? ACROSS RUSSIA FROM THE BALTIC TO THE DANUBE 1892 BY CHARLES AUGUSTUS STODDART (Chapter) XXXVI. THROUGH THE CARPATHIAN MOUNTAINS. ENTERING HUNGARY A MAGYAR WATERING-PLACE — POPRAD AND ITS PEOPLE CLIMBING THE KOLBACHTHAL SCHMECKE AND THE HUNGARIANS. After so many days spent in cities, it was refreshing to contemplate an excursion where the beauties and wonders of nature were to be the chief attractions. We left Cracow in an early train for Ruttka, and travelled from thence to Poprad in Hungary.The railway is built among hills and mountains which remind an American of the Berkshire Hills and the White Mountains. Ranges of lofty and jagged peaks came into view as we travelled along, among them the lofty ridges of the Carpathians and spurs from this important chain of mountains.The women with little green sticks who serve as sentinels upon the Russian railways gave place to men and women stationed at every mile, with round straw targets which they placed in the centre of the railway track and removed for the passage of the train. The train is obliged to stop unless this target is removed, and as soon as the train passes the target is replaced. The system is simple but secure, and we questioned whether all of our automatic and 242 THROUGH THE CARPATHIAN MOUNTAINS. 243 labor-saving contrivances were as effective in preventing accident as these Hungarian peasants with their simple circles of braided straw. Trustworthy service in simple ways from human beings is worth more than the brainless labor of the most costly and intricate machinery. The great difficulty in the United States is to get service that can be depended upon. Our workmen and employe's are so eager to get on, to change their occupation, to do something beside their regular work, to have "a good time" while they are working, that whole-souled or whole-minded and devoted service is almost unknown. These Hungarian railway employe's were satisfied to do nothing else than lift these signals on and off the track all day long, from year's end to year's end, a humble employment that the average American would disdain, and could not be depended on to do it faith fully for a single week. Perhaps competition and hard times will teach subordinates in all branches of labor the importance of minding their business, and the truth of the axiom that " what's worth doing at all is worth doing well." Through valleys where the grain was piled in stacks and among mountains which were cultivated to their very tops, and on whose long sloping shoulders the harvesters were at work we travelled on. At Oderburg an observation car had been placed at our disposal, and as the roadbed was well ballasted, and rain had fallen in the night, it was delightful to watch the changing scenery from the rear of the train as we climbed up the grades into the heart of the mountains where Poprad is situated. 244 We had lost sight of the Polish Jews, whose cork screw curls, high caps, and filthy gaberdines had haunted us at Warsaw and Cracow. The last link was broken when we crossed the frontier, and an old fellow with a beard like Abraham, and the shrewdness of Jacob at a bargain, perambulated the railway platform with a handful of paper money of the country which he was offering to exchange for English sovereigns with the premium all upon the side of his dirty Austrian bills, while it ought to have been just the other way. Travellers are made to be plundered by money-changers, however, and we furnished our share to the greedy Jew. As we climbed higher the scenery became wilder, the air, which had been so dead and oppressive at Cracow, acquired tone and vigor, and a decided coolness made us thankful for shawls and wraps. For miles the railroad follows a large river on which large timber-rafts were frequent; on each side of the track honey-locust trees are growing, and gardens full of flowers and roses at the stations and at the houses of the sentinels. Little villages appeared now and then as we wound up from valley to valley, —a cluster of weather-stained timber or stone houses with a church in the centre. We had come into a Roman Catholic country, as indicated by the crosses along the roads, and the absence of icons. Here we have images and crucifixes instead of pictures in silver frames ; but with the exception that the people seem a little less religious there is no difference worth mentioning. About sunset we reached Poprad, a straggling
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Post by kaima on May 12, 2019 22:18:50 GMT -7
THROUGH THE CARPATHIAN MOUNTAINS. 245 town whose attraction consists in its extensive bath houses and water-cures, and its proximity to Schmecke, a summer resort among hills like those of Saxon Switzerland. After a struggle with the drivers of several hundred nondescript vehicles, all of whom claimed us as their prey, we were driven to the Hiish Platz, where somewhat primitive accommodations awaited us. The place reminded me of the Greenbrier White Sulphur Springs in Virginia, though it was not so picturesque. In a valley, sur rounded by mountains beautifully wooded for two-thirds of their height, and rough and jagged towards their summits, the springs are found which make the place a resort. Here a large park is laid out with two-story brick cottages in considerable numbers, dining and dancing-halls, and all the accompaniments of the modern watering-place. A Hungarian band was playing wild music, and at tables beside fountains, and in summer-houses covered with vines, groups of military officers and elegantly dressed ladies were chatting; other groups of men were smoking long Turkish pipes and drinking beer, and a few children playing about added life and variety to the scene. The whole air of the place was differ ent from anything in Russia, and we felt that we were in another land. There was a mingling of the lively gayety of the Viennese and the formality of the better class of Hungarians which was interesting and sometimes amusing. The watering-place is not a good place to stay in, for the buildings and grounds are damp and very cold at night, and the accommodations were ordinary and not very neat.
246 The next day we took carriages up the hills to Schmecke, which is a much nicer place, with good hotels and villas, and far better in a sanitary point of view. From this starting-point we climbed up the Kolbachthal, amidst the wildest sort of mountain scenery, and were rewarded by fine views of lofty aiguilles and waterfalls, and far-extending plains, through which a river ran like a thread of silver. At the summer hotel upon the mountain we had a dinner of cabbage in four courses, viz. cabbage soup, Hamburg steak and cabbage, chicken and cabbage salad, and pancake and sweet cabbage. Hunger is a good sauce, and the long climb had fitted us to enjoy even this rather peculiar meal. Language being rather mixed at this resort, some of the party essayed a somewhat original style of Volapiik, which, how ever, proved a failure in Hungary, though it was said to have been very effective under similar cir cumstances in the land of the Midnight Sun.
In Hungary everything seems very strange; the people are a handsome, black-eyed, black-haired race, handsomely formed, straight and tall, with none of the ponderosity and dulness of the Russians. The women are attractive, and many beautiful faces greet the traveller. The houses in the villages are curious structures, looking, in the distance, like military chapeaus. They are built in one or two stories of stone, overlaid with stucco, and covered with a curious, wide-spreading roof, curled up at the edges like the roll of a hat. The doors and windows of the lower story are very small, and every window has a grating for purposes of protection and defence. The
THROUGH THE CARPATHIAN MOUNTAINS. 247 fields were full of the peasantry, gathering the harvest, which seemed very abundant, and the cultivation was careful and thorough. There was an air of independence and thrift in the farming country and in the towns, though the latter were evidently destitute of Boards of Health and Street-cleaning Com missioners. Horses, mules, and asses were much used in field work, in which men, women, and children dressed in picturesque costumes also joined.
A day or two in the pure mountain air greatly refreshed us after the exhausting sight-seeing of cities, and we were glad to exchange the long railway journeys for drives through mountain scenery, with good- natured drivers, and the opportunity to walk or stop, as we chose, and to spend our nights away from the noisy pavements in the quiet country.
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Post by kaima on May 12, 2019 22:20:08 GMT -7
That is a report I ran across in my eBook library and thought it would add to the topic on 'how to get to Poprad". I do not have time to put modern names to the old names he uses for towns and locations.
Kai
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Post by Jaga on May 12, 2019 23:14:58 GMT -7
In some boarder areas like Spisz and Orawa that were divided between Poland and Slovakia there are some very nationalistic people. Generally Slovaks are really nice, and more jovial and dark haired and also farming-like people compared to urban Czechs. There is quite a big population of wealthy gypsy population is Slovakia. Slovakia is also much less crowded than Poland which is so nice. My parents knew some interesting and very educated Slovaks that believed that Slovakia and Czechs should separate even if Slovakia would lose financially on this division. There are just two different peoples. Thank you for your description of your travel to Poprad. Were there large differences between Poland and Slovakia (which was part of Czechoslovakia back then) in your opinion Jaga?
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Post by pieter on May 15, 2019 8:03:34 GMT -7
Dear Jaga, Kaima and Karl,
I love your replies and would love it if we could post a litle more threads, posts and replies about Poland, the Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, Germany and Austria on our Forum like this.
I think that the German and Austrian element could be possible if you look at the Prussian, Volsksdeutsche, German minority aspects of Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary and the Austrian presence in Central-Europe.
Poland next to be a strong Roman-Catholic Western slavic culture with an ethnic, cultural, linguistic and religious and political identity is also a country, nation, people and entity with Bohemian, Moravian, Wend, Slovak, Ruthenian, Lithuanian, Ashkenazi jewish and Sephardic jewish, Silesian, Kashubian, Goral, Karaite, Khazar, Dutch Mennonite, German Lutheran, Italian renaissance (Italian painters and architects of Polish kings and noblemen, the magnates), Swedish (the Wasa kings), Austrian, Hungarian, and a little bit of Russian, Ukrainian, Belarussian, Latvian, Estonian, Romanian, Georgian, Armenian, Greek, Tartar, American, Canadian, French, British and other influences.
With the list above I mean the old regognized minorities who are already for centuries in Poland since the early Polish kingdoms and the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and during the partitions and the Polish independence since 1918. But also later immigrants, expats, foreign people who married with Polish men and Polish women and became Poles with another ehtnic and linguistic background (for instance Anne Applebaum, who is the 'American' wife of the Polish politician and journalist Radosław Sikorski, who lives in Warsaw and speaks Polish fluently).
There must be a lot of interesting topics we can post about the Slovakian country and the Slovak cities; Bratislava, Košice, Prešov, Žilina, Banská Bystrica, Nitra, Trnava, Martin, Trenčín and Poprad. And stories to tell about the Slovak regions Bratislava Region (Bratislavský kraj), Trnava Region (Trnavský kraj), Nitriansky kraj, Trenčiansky kraj, Banskobystrický kraj, Žilinský kraj, Košický kraj and the Prešovský kraj.
The same counts for the Czech cities and regions ( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czech_Republic ) and ofcourse Hungary, Austria and Germany.
Cheers, Pieter
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Post by pieter on May 21, 2019 8:50:22 GMT -7
Slovakia
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Post by pieter on May 21, 2019 8:52:20 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 21, 2019 8:54:35 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 21, 2019 9:11:02 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 21, 2019 9:12:20 GMT -7
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