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Post by pieter on Aug 24, 2020 16:11:56 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Aug 24, 2020 16:14:26 GMT -7
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Post by Jaga on Aug 24, 2020 20:00:42 GMT -7
Pieter, this looks like a hopeless and terrible situation for white farmers and some black farm workers in South Africa. I remember in 90s Soith AFrica was recruiting many men from Eastern Europe for their police forces, but I am pretty sure many of them came back. You right, that now there is a time to just leave. I hope your sister and her family will remain safe.
The Polish translation was pretty good. In the past usually the text was translated well from Polish to English but not the other way around. But it looks that there is a big progress now in the digital world. Unfortunately the politics and the cultures seems to be in demise....
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Post by pieter on Aug 25, 2020 3:21:09 GMT -7
Jaga,
The problem in the world is the racial, tribal, ethnic, cultural, religious, financial-economical and social division and discord. Despite human development, progress and civilisation, behind the thin layer of that civilisation lies animalistic tribalism, clan thinking and 'own people first' ideas. I saw an old movie of the English primatologist and anthropologist Dame Jane Morris Goodall DBE (born Valerie Jane Morris-Goodall on 3 April 1934).
Goodall also observed the tendency for aggression and violence within chimpanzee troops. Goodall observed dominant females deliberately killing the young of other females in the troop to maintain their dominance, sometimes going as far as cannibalism. She says of this revelation, "During the first ten years of the study I had believed […] that the Gombe chimpanzees were, for the most part, rather nicer than human beings. […] Then suddenly we found that chimpanzees could be brutal—that they, like us, had a darker side to their nature."
In South-Africa and other parts of the world Human beings acted and act like these chimpanzees, without the canibalist element. The Afrikaner settlers, the British colonialists and the aggressive Zulu and Xsosa worrier tribes. We are not better than these animals.
Fact is that all over the world people act like beasts today. Europe, Northern-America, Southern-America, the Middle east, the Far East, Oceania. Everywhere you have tensions between races, different ethnic groups, poor against rich and vice versa, tensions between different ideologies, tensions between different ethnic groups and tensions between religions and within religions. Even within the Sunni Islam between various brands of Sunni Islam (Islamic State -Daesh- vs Jabhat Fatah al-Sham -Al-Nusra Front or Jabhat al-Nusra-), within Shia Islam between various brands of Shia Islam (in Lebanon in the past between Hezbollah and Amal, in Iraq between various fractions and Iran between the Iranian regime and Mujahedin-e Khalq), within Judaism between secular jews and Ultra-Orthodox jews and within religious judaism between Jewish Orthodoxy on one side and Progressive Judaism, conservative (Masorti) Judaism and Reform Judaism/Reconstructivist Judaism on the other side, and within Christianity between the Irish Nationalist Roman Catholics and the Calvinist Protestant Ulster Loyalist and Unionists in Northern Ireland, Catholic Croats and Christian Orthodox Serbs in Bosnia Herzegovina and between Orthodox Ukrainians and Orthodox Russians in the Ukraine. Division seems to rise in the Western world as well, with growing political tribalism, clan thinking and wings and movements. Republicans moving to the right and democrats moving to the left despite Biden Harris 2020. In Europe too the left and right are drifting apart and also here the gap between rich and poor is growing due to the Corona crisis.
We saw it in Rwanda where the majority people, the Hutu's, massacred the minority consisting of Tutsi's and a minority of moderate Hutu's who tried to save, help or hide Tutsi friends, colleagues or family members. In South-Africa tribal, political, social economical, ethnic and criminal conflicts lead to murders and massacres as well. From the Sharpville massacre of 21 March 1960 under the National Party Apartheid regime, when 69 people were killed, to the Marikana massacre, on 16 August 2012, the killing of 34 miners by the South African Police Service (SAPS) who serve under the ANC administration.
Next to this the continuous and ongoing murder campaign against white Afrikaner Boer farmers. A campaign which has a radical political, extremist and racist (anti-white) agenda, because in most cases these murderers, torturers (mutilating people), rapists and vandals don't steal anything or minor objects.
The mutual hatred, social, ethnic and cultural division in South-Africa is large. A fierce hatred of the whites amongst ANC, Economic Freedom Fighters, Black First Land First (BLF) and the Pan Africanist Congress of Azania (PAC) exists, and as a result of that there is a fear amongst the White South African Afrikaner people and amongst the white English South Africans and other white European people in South Africa (European immigrants, expats and probably embassy and consulate personal of European, American, Canadian, Australian and New Zealand embassies and consulates).
The Coloured people of the Western Cape are in between the Black majority and the white minority and they feel excluded by both the Blacks and the Whites. Both under the Apartheid regime of the Nasionale Party of Pieter Willem Botha and the present ANC government of Cyril Ramaphosa the Coloured feel that they are left asside and discriminated against. Under the Nasionale Party the Whites dominated between 1948 and 1990, and under the ANC government from 1994 until today the Blacks dominate and become more dominant every year. South-Africa today is not a good country for White people, coloured people, Indian Hindu people, other Asians and foreign African migrants due to Black South African xenophobia and violence towards Black African migrants from Zimbabwe, the Congo, Mozambique and Somalia.Cheers,
Pieter
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Post by pieter on Aug 25, 2020 7:44:20 GMT -7
Pieter, this looks like a hopeless and terrible situation for white farmers and some black farm workers in South Africa. I remember in 90s Soith AFrica was recruiting many men from Eastern Europe for their police forces, but I am pretty sure many of them came back. You right, that now there is a time to just leave. I hope your sister and her family will remain safe. The Polish translation was pretty good. In the past usually the text was translated well from Polish to English but not the other way around. But it looks that there is a big progress now in the digital world. Unfortunately the politics and the cultures seems to be in demise....
I do believe that the White Afrikaner Boer farmers, but also the other Black farmers have to reconsider the way they work and live. Maybe painful negotiations, concessions and redistribution of land will help the White farmers to survive. Today they live and work on to large spaces with to few families concentrated in one area, which makes them vulnerable. Maybe White Afrikaner Boer farmers should look at their ancestors of the Great Trek (de Grote Trek), the Voortrekkers, and move to one particular area, where they can create an Afrikaner farmers space with Afrikaner communities, cooperatives and farm economies.
Today they are shooting ducks for political motived armed attacks, criminal attacks and hate crimes. I think their future lies in their communities, Communal land, agricultural communal groups and more Reproduction (or procreation or breeding). The Afrikaner people should double or triple their amount of people. And they could learn from the Pillarisation period in the Dutch history. The three pillars in the Dutch society, namely the Protestant, Catholic and social-democratic pillars were very good in self-organisation. Financially, economically, socially, culturally and politically.
Without repeating the past of the Apartheid, the Afrikaners could organise themselves as a pillar in the South-African society, next to the English South-African, Coloured, Xsosa, Zulu, Sotho and Swahili pillars in the South-African society. The present South-African society and economy doesn't employ whites, so therefor the whites have to employ themselves. Especially the vulnerable, impoverished and desperate poor white Afrikaner communities who live in White slums, which you could call white townships. With white employers and white employees in white firms, companies and shops and supermarkets and agricultural firms. They have to because no-one will help them due to the affirmative action (Broad-based Black Economic Empowerment) of the ANC government for Black people only.
Broad-based Black Economic Empowerment
The Broad-based Black Economic Empowerment (BBBEE) is an intergration programme launched by the South African government to reconcile South Africans and redress the inequalities of Apartheid by attempting to compensate for land that was disposed from Africans. It encourages businesses to integrate black people in the workspace, upskill and mentor, support black businesses, give back to mainly poor communities accross the country which remain poor due to the land dispossession and a majority of this communities are black South Africans. Land which is still owned by the white minority of Afrikaner, English South Africans (Anglo Africans) and other Europeans like British, Dutch, Belgian, French, Israeli's (of European Ashkenazi descent mostly), Russian, Spanish, Italian and Greek people. For this exercise businesses are awarded points which they can claim on their BBBEE certificate. This certificate is used in compliance with government spend regulations. Businesses with a good level in BBBEE stand a good chance on government contracts. In practice this Broad-based Black Economic Empowerment (BBBEE) benefits Black South-Africans and works at the disadvantage of White South-Africans, Coloured South-Africans, Asian South-Africans and other Non-Black people in South Africa. The ANC serves the Black majority which is it's support base.
Orania
The Afrikaner town Orania in South Africa located along the Orange River (Oranje rivier) in the Karoo region of the Northern Cape province could be an example for an autonomous Afrikaner region, state or larger community in South Africa. Orania is split in two halves by the R369 road and lies halfway between Cape Town and Pretoria.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orania,_Northern_Cape
The stated aim of the town is to create a stronghold for Afrikaans (language) and the Afrikaner identity (Nationalism) by keeping their language and culture alive. Anyone who defines themselves as an Afrikaner and identifies with Afrikaner ethnicity is welcome to live in Orania.
In the US, European, British and Free Western perspective in which equality, cosmopolitanism, liberalism, democracy and Freedom are important it is hard to understand the Afrikaner Nationalism and Orania, but in the reality of South Africa they exist. South Africa is a multi ethnic state with various peoples, tribes, subtribes and clans. South-Africa is not Europe, nor the USA, Canada, Australia nor New Zealand, South-Africa is South Africa in Southern Africa on the African continent.
Cheers,
Pieter |
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Post by kaima on Aug 28, 2020 21:44:09 GMT -7
I do believe that the White Afrikaner Boer farmers, but also the other Black farmers have to reconsider the way they work and live. Maybe painful negotiations, concessions and redistribution of land will help the White farmers to survive. Today they live and work on to large spaces with to few families concentrated in one area, which makes them vulnerable. Maybe White Afrikaner Boer farmers should look at their ancestors of the Great Trek (de Grote Trek), the Voortrekkers, and move to one particular area, where they can create an Afrikaner farmers space with Afrikaner communities, cooperatives and farm economies. Pieter, I have heard it said that Americans and Russians share a "large country perspective" that Europeans cannot comprehend, because of the very large distances we must travel in our countries. Personally, I feel one effect of the extreme distances in the USA is that we are at a great disadvantage in measuring economic productivity. We must transport components for our products and our partially finished / finished products much, much further than countries in Europe must do. Another aspect of the great geographic distances we must travel carries over into agriculture - through distances we encompass many climates, and wet and dry extremes that Europeans are not accustomed to. I suspect - but cannot state with certainty - that South Africa faces the same variations in extremes between climates, and thus many parts of South Africa , as in the American west, because of dry climate and poor growing climates, must have large ranches covering many acres to produce a reasonable crop - and even more so support, cattle or sheep. The dry climates in the American west led to the Dust Bowl of the 1930's with too many farmers trying to take advantage of very high sales prices by plowing up all the acerage they could manage, and then the dry extreme hit and drove so many out of business. (It is only in the last 5 or ten years that I heard the US bought up the land at the center of the Dust Bowl and created a National Grasslands reserve, thus preventing a recurrence of the Dust Bowl). So I must wonder about economics of scale - how many acres a farmer must farm to remain competitive, how many are needed simply for survival at a better-than-subsistence level? And, perhaps as you point out, would a new economic model support communities rather than individual families? Then again, there is ultimately the Golden Rule: Those with the Gold make the Rules! Kai |
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Post by karl on Aug 29, 2020 7:42:10 GMT -7
Pieter
This is a very disturbing situation but then not unexpected. For once the flood gates were opened after apartheid ended and white rule was turned to black rule from the Nelson Mandela days to present. Violence to white people would and is the expected situation. For the unspoken plan of the day, is to remove whites and make South Africa all black.
For as Jaga has fore spoken, it is my hope that your family will escape out of harms way.
Karl
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