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Post by kaima on Jun 13, 2009 20:58:01 GMT -7
Now you've got me going... ...If they would have cut taxes (like China has done!) they would have encouraged the investment of REAL money, instead of the newly printed FAKE money. So the private money is sitting on the sidelines, with no incentive whatever to invest; on the contrary, the rich are hoarding their money, concerned that they are about to be taxed to the fullest extent of the law. Saddest thing to say: My two daughters, ages 22 and 14(!), have both told me on separate occasions they see no future for themselves in this economy.... At what point of the recovery do we stop cutting taxes and start a conservative effort to pay our debts? I agree the money seems to be fake, but that is a continuation of decades of monetary policy and wild, irresponsible spending. If Bush cut taxes in times of surplus, in times of national tragedy and in times of war, and cut taxes during seeming prosperity, when do you wish the nation to start a reasonable tax program and try to balance the budget? That does not seem to be on either Democratic or on Republican agendas, although Clinton did leave the nation with surplus - a conservative financial condition! We can not live forever on borrowed money. Do you accept some personal responsibility for the lower standard of living your daughters will live with? Kai
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Post by tuftabis on Jun 14, 2009 7:16:18 GMT -7
I wonder if part of the trouble that grew over the years is not connected to ... read on: AMERICANS like to think of themselves as martyrs to work. They delight in telling stories about their punishing hours, snatched holidays and ever-intrusive BlackBerrys. At this time of the year they marvel at the laziness of their European cousins, particularly the French. Did you know that the French take the whole of August off to recover from their 35-hour work weeks? Have you heard that they are so addicted to their holidays that they leave the sick to die and the dead to moulder?
There is an element of exaggeration in this, of course, and not just about French burial habits; studies show that Americans are less Stakhanovite than they think. Still, the average American gets only four weeks of paid leave a year compared with seven for the French and eight for the Germans. In Paris many shops simply close down for August; in Washington, where the weather is sweltering, they remain open, some for 24 hours a day.
But when it comes to the young the situation is reversed. American children have it easier than most other children in the world, including the supposedly lazy Europeans. They have one of the shortest school years anywhere, a mere 180 days compared with an average of 195 for OECD countries and more than 200 for East Asian countries. German children spend 20 more days in school than American ones, and South Koreans over a month more. Over 12 years, a 15-day deficit means American children lose out on 180 days of school, equivalent to an entire year.
American children also have one of the shortest school days, six-and-a-half hours, adding up to 32 hours a week. By contrast, the school week is 37 hours in Luxembourg, 44 in Belgium, 53 in Denmark and 60 in Sweden. On top of that, American children do only about an hour’s-worth of homework a day, a figure that stuns the Japanese and Chinese.
Americans also divide up their school time oddly. They cram the school day into the morning and early afternoon, and close their schools for three months in the summer. The country that tut-tuts at Europe’s mega-holidays thinks nothing of giving its children such a lazy summer. But the long summer vacation acts like a mental eraser, with the average child reportedly forgetting about a month’s-worth of instruction in many subjects and almost three times that in mathematics. American academics have even invented a term for this phenomenon, “summer learning loss”. This pedagogical understretch is exacerbating social inequalities. Poorer children frequently have no one to look after them in the long hours between the end of the school day and the end of the average working day. They are also particularly prone to learning loss. They fall behind by an average of over two months in their reading. Richer children actually improve their performance.
The understretch is also leaving American children ill-equipped to compete. They usually perform poorly in international educational tests, coming behind Asian countries that spend less on education but work their children harder. California’s state universities have to send over a third of their entering class to take remedial courses in English and maths. At least a third of successful PhD students come from abroad.
A growing number of politicians from both sides of the aisle are waking up to the problem. Barack Obama has urged school administrators to “rethink the school day”, arguing that “we can no longer afford an academic calendar designed for when America was a nation of farmers who needed their children at home ploughing the land at the end of each day.” Newt Gingrich has trumpeted a documentary arguing that Chinese and Indian children are much more academic than American ones.
These politicians have no shortage of evidence that America’s poor educational performance is weakening its economy. A recent report from McKinsey, a management consultancy, argues that the lagging performance of the country’s school pupils, particularly its poor and minority children, has wreaked more devastation on the economy than the current recession. Learning the lesson
A growing number of schools are already doing what Mr Obama urges, and experimenting with lengthening the school day. About 1,000 of the country’s 90,000 schools have broken the shackles of the regular school day. In particular, charter schools in the Knowledge is Power Programme (KIPP) start the school day at 7.30am and end at 5pm, hold classes on some Saturdays and teach for a couple of weeks in the summer. All in all, KIPP students get about 60% more class time than their peers and routinely score better in tests.
Still, American schoolchildren are unlikely to end up working as hard as the French, let alone the South Koreans, any time soon. There are institutional reasons for this. The federal government has only a limited influence over the school system. Powerful interest groups, most notably the teachers’ unions, but also the summer-camp industry, have a vested interest in the status quo. But reformers are also up against powerful cultural forces.
One is sentimentality; the archetypical American child is Huckleberry Finn, who had little taste for formal education. Another is complacency. American parents have led grass-root protests against attempts to extend the school year into August or July, or to increase the amount of homework their little darlings have to do. They still find it hard to believe that all those Chinese students, beavering away at their books, will steal their children’s jobs. But Huckleberry Finn was published in 1884. And brain work is going the way of manual work, to whoever will provide the best value for money. The next time Americans make a joke about the Europeans and their taste for la dolce vita, they ought to take a look a bit closer to home. www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displayStory.cfm?story_id=13825184&source=most_commented
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Post by Jaga on Jun 14, 2009 9:15:15 GMT -7
American children also have one of the shortest school days, six-and-a-half hours, adding up to 32 hours a week. By contrast, the school week is 37 hours in Luxembourg, 44 in Belgium, 53 in Denmark and 60 in Sweden. On top of that, American children do only about an hour’s-worth of homework a day, a figure that stuns the Japanese and Chinese.
Americans also divide up their school time oddly. They cram the school day into the morning and early afternoon, and close their schools for three months in the summer. The country that tut-tuts at Europe’s mega-holidays thinks nothing of giving its children such a lazy summer. But the long summer vacation acts like a mental eraser, with the average child reportedly forgetting about a month’s-worth of instruction in many subjects and almost three times that in mathematics. American academics have even invented a term for this phenomenon, “summer learning loss”. This pedagogical understretch is exacerbating social inequalities. Poorer children frequently have no one to look after them in the long hours between the end of the school day and the end of the average working day. They are also particularly prone to learning loss. They fall behind by an average of over two months in their reading. Richer children actually improve their performance.
here in Idaho there are the districts were kids go to school only 4 days a week. Some conservatives and libertarians here in America believe that there should be NO PUBLIC SCHOOLING. Next to Idaho Falls there is a city of Ammon where people build huge houses since taxes are low. Since taxes are low people do not pay much for schools and the schools are even worse than in Idaho Falls.
This is what pure American capitalism is about - just spend money for military but not for schools.
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Post by Jaga on Jun 14, 2009 9:22:41 GMT -7
I like the picture of a boy - it is so typical
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cfn
Junior Pole
Posts: 103
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Post by cfn on Jun 14, 2009 18:41:22 GMT -7
Well, I appreciate all your comments; I hope I did you some good in venting these feelings! (I'm teasing, I'm not offended.) You are assuming I am for deficits. You assume wrong. I have heard, and I believe my sources as I deem them trustworthy, that you actually get more money by cutting taxes than by raising them. That said...to make the leap that I, because I favor cutting taxes, must then be in favor of the huge deficit spending that Bush and Reagan indulged in, is not a fair leap. I think that a true conservative would not do such. Now a country-club conservative might. A neo-conservative might ("neo" means "new"). "There is nothing new under the sun." A conservative, by definition, is someone who conserves what he thinks is good about his society. This would include "conserving" the public wealth and financial health--such large deficits are not true conservatism from centuries back. (It seems we have to label all our old ways--what used to be financial common sense is now labeled a derivative of financial conservation.) We all know many of our parents were very conservative...they would not dream, I suppose, of such deficit spending. That is why I am saying there's no such thing as "new" conservatism. Because there's really "nothing new under the sun." When someone says they've got something new under their sleeve, watch out!!
Now as to my "personal responsibility" for these deficits. I'm a guy who rode his bike to work 49 times last year: when gas in America got up to $3 per gallon, I said, "Heck no!" It was a 16-mile round trip. I actually felt better than I had for the last 15 years. You don't know me and you are making a huge leap once again. I'm not offended, but I really do not see how you think I am personally involved in this. I do not write my candidates about every little thing...I did write Bush, urging him not to undertake the auto bailout Obama wanted him to do--but, of course, he did not listen. Honestly, I think most of our world's leaders, at least in the west, are adherents to a one-world type of governmental view. How else do you explain their trying to bankrupt America, both Republican and Democrat (except Clinton, though he left the military in disrepair). Somehow I feel there is a connection. The elites do not think that "regular," whatever that means, people know how to run their affairs and so their voice must be muted. I hope you all see that that is happening with many of your countries, too. A lot of governmental decisions do not make any sense unless you take this into view.
A lot of your other points were very good and interesting, and things which I AGREE WITH, BY THE WAY! Do you think I like America's demise?
As to making a political point over my daughters' misfortune....
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cfn
Junior Pole
Posts: 103
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Post by cfn on Jun 14, 2009 18:56:58 GMT -7
I think your comments about education were very accurate, Tuftabis. One of the big reforms Republicans tried to accomplish was to reform education. It was impossible, of course, with the chokehold the heads of the teachers' unions have on the system. The Democrats are totally beholden (they owe) to them. Education is impossible when you have no discipline in the classroom. Any reforms are effectively quashed.
Private schools in America cost maybe 1/2 to 2/3 as much as public schools per student...with better results. So it is not a problem of "capitalism" refusing to throw money at the problem, Jaga. Though it would be more true to say "socialism" is the one throwing the money away at a failed system in America. Capitalism is based on merit. That is, it is based on excellence in a competition, so to speak. Whenever people try to link teacher pay with merit or other reforms, they are blocked by socialism. Creativity is stifled. It is frustrating. We probably spend more per student than almost every other country, with much worse results! Do you not agree?
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Post by kaima on Jun 14, 2009 22:24:39 GMT -7
Paul,
As far as my comments, they stand as they are. Part of my questioning was to see if you accept a share of the blame for allowing the government to do the irresponsible things they have done, or if you take the approach that you were innocent.
I believe by our inaction and lack of demand for accountability we, the citizens, are ultimately responsible. We were too easily swayed to support liberal debt spending by both Republicans and Democrats. In Alaska anyone claiming to be "more conservative than my opponent" stands a very big chance of being elected, and then they spend like drunks. Including Palin.
Neo-con does not stand for neo-conservative, but rather neo-con-artist.
Kai
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Post by tuftabis on Jun 15, 2009 4:46:06 GMT -7
I think your comments about education were very accurate, Tuftabis. Paul, these were not my comments - I just happened to read an article during the weekend which well suited the discussion in this forum, so I thought many will find it interesting and posted it. Please note it was posted in italics. That is the way of citing too. When soemthing out from the forum is cited, it is usally being signalled by applying italics are any other way. Also, please note the link at the end - if you click on it the original source will open. I'm glad you liked the article!
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Post by dbkaczor on Jun 15, 2009 5:23:43 GMT -7
I believe by our inaction and lack of demand for accountability we, the citizens, are ultimately responsible. We were too easily swayed to support liberal debt spending by both Republicans and Democrats. Kai, i disagree. Over the last few years i became involved. Writing my senators, governor, the president. I attended rallies. I signed countless petitions also signed by hundreds of thousands of other citizens. The politicians do not represent us at all. They are so manipulated and owned and greed driven. Maybe we have protested too meekly? After all, we are now conditioned to not dare offend anyone.
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Post by kaima on Jun 15, 2009 9:51:11 GMT -7
Kai, i disagree. Over the last few years i became involved. Writing my senators, governor, the president. I attended rallies. I signed countless petitions also signed by hundreds of thousands of other citizens. The politicians do not represent us at all. They are so manipulated and owned and greed driven. Maybe we have protested too meekly? After all, we are now conditioned to not dare offend anyone. DB, I have to agree with you, but too, too few of us objected! We should have protested long and loud and over the decades before things reached the extremes of today. I worked for the military and voted for Ted Stevens on a regular basis, and both were tremendous wasters of money. I became so accustomed to the waste ("any military dollar spent is a good dollar spent. It is unpatriotic to question military spending." that I came to look upon it as play money, the spending was pushed so far beyond belief. So I have to include myself among the guilty. I just doubt that paulerikson is capable of owning up to his own involvement in the grand fraud that cheated his own children. By the way, thanks for your protesting. I am glad there are some active, sensible patriots out there. Kai
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Post by dbkaczor on Jun 15, 2009 10:18:45 GMT -7
kai, do you think that not enough people put forth the effort because they are just overwhelmed with responsibilities? many folks are raising children, working harder, more hours for less money to keep their jobs. these people have to deal with paying for health care for their families, childcare so that they can go to work, all the expenses of having children, energy, taxes and food costs which keep rising and on top of that, many families have only one or no breadwinner right now. its tough out there and people like myself who are working more than 1 job to make ends meet have no spare time as it is. also now many people are caught in a credit crisis of their own due to effects of the mismanagement of others (and some from their own mismanagement), there is widespread panic and high levels of personal stress to stay above the red line. it is a major hardship for many to spend their precious spare time writing letters, going to rallies etc. the govt has us just where they want us. unable to protest. i am trying to fight it whichever way i can, but they have us by the short hairs. and its going to get tighter and tighter i can see. we will be totally controlled.
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Post by kaima on Jun 15, 2009 17:02:48 GMT -7
kai, do you think that not enough people put forth the effort because they are just overwhelmed with responsibilities? Yes and no. I am looking at the US since WW II, therefore involving that and all subsequent generations. People were not overwhelmed all of that time. My own conclusion is that the people are lazy, generation after generation, and they (we) did get the government they deserved! Kai
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Post by Jaga on Jun 15, 2009 22:11:52 GMT -7
I agree with dbkaczor that the letters to the senators often do not work. I agree with Paul, that not only Republican policies but also some Democratic policies are bad for schools - like keeping some California teachers on the payroll after they were accused for improper behabior. I agree with Kaima that there is some guilt from us, babyboomers....
dbkaczor,
the priorities should change. Americans became a very comsumption-driven society. It seems that they want to have stuff rather than invest in their kids future. What is more important? Another expensive toy or better education? What is more important? Spending time with the family or having time for kids?
In Poland we emphasized (at least in the past), spiritual sphere rather than material/comsumptive sphere of life.
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