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Post by Jaga on Sept 8, 2007 8:03:13 GMT -7
We talked about it in one thread in the past. Just a couple of days ago Frankfurter Algemeine Zeitung appealed for Poland to return German heritage in the first page! So, the arguments are heating up on both sides. Here are some of the more recent commentaries: english.people.com.cn/90001/90782/6249461.htmlPolish Foreign Minister Anna Fotyga said Monday that Poland was entitled to request compensation for its huge loss of cultural property assets during World War II. She made the remarks in response to a recent request by Germany to regain the Prussian Library collections that have been under Poland's preservation since the end of the war. Fotyga said the cultural treasures in question were not seized with force by Poland, and they now belong to Poland under international law, she said. Noting that Poland had suffered enormous cultural damage worth over 20 billion U.S. dollars during the plunder by Nazi Germany, she said her nation was in a better position to ask for compensation. Poland had "made a mistake," because it had never requested such compensation, said Fotyga. The minister said she will press for the compilation of a detailed list of Polish cultural property lost in the war. ... |
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Post by Jaga on Sept 8, 2007 8:03:56 GMT -7
and from Guardian: Poles furious at German 'war booty' claim Kate Connolly in Berlin Wednesday August 29, 2007 The Guardian The Polish government is demanding billions of euros in compensation from Germany for cultural artefacts which were stolen or destroyed during the second world war, after accusing Berlin of trying to rewrite history. The foreign minister, Anna Fotyga, said a list was being prepared of all the cultural treasures Poland lost to Germany, in a riposte to a recent call from Berlin for Poland to return "war booty" it said had been stolen from Germany. Ms Fotyga said Poland had stolen nothing from Germany, rather the German cultural treasures in Poland were "left behind by fleeing Nazis" at the end of the war and according to international law "they belong to Poland". Ms Fotyga, whose government faces an election in October, instead urged Germany to recognise the cultural devastation it had wrought in Poland. "We estimate our losses to be more than $20bn [£10bn]," she said. www.guardian.co.uk/germany/article/0,,2157880,00.html |
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Post by Jaga on Sept 8, 2007 8:05:58 GMT -7
and more:
Germany's demands last month for the return of thousands of works of art it claims are being hidden in secret depots in Poland, has angered Poles, aware as they are that following the Warsaw Uprising of 1944, the Nazis spent three months systematically destroying the Polish capital, including burning the national library to the ground as well as hundreds of other libraries and archives housing valuable medieval scripts and priceless manuscripts. Before that, Reichsmarschall Hermann Göring ordered the plundering of castles, museums, palaces and manor houses across the country. The symbol of that destruction is a glass urn containing the ashes of a burned book from the once famous Krasinksi library in Warsaw, which was destroyed by the Nazis.
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Post by rdywenur on Sept 8, 2007 10:44:10 GMT -7
They say two wrongs do not make a right. Seems both parties have lots to work out. What is fair in war...nothing. And the most valuable are lives which could never be replaced.
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Post by pieter on Sept 8, 2007 12:20:25 GMT -7
I voted; No, Germany destroyed Poland and Polish heritage!
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Pawian
European
Have you seen my frog?
Posts: 3,266
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Post by Pawian on Sept 8, 2007 12:55:37 GMT -7
I voted; No, Germany destroyed Poland and Polish heritage! I voted yes, on certain conditions. Germans can take their composers` manuscripts, I don`t need them . Currently these papers are hidden in basements of the Biblioteka Jagiellońska in Krakow and the public can`t see them anyway so I won`t lose much. hahahahaha There is a problem with planes. They are exhibited in the Museum of Aviation in Krakow close to my home. We often go there, the German planes from WW1 are displayed in a specially built hangar. I can agree to the return of these planes to Germany without broken heart because old planes never interested me too much. But Germans, if they want their flying treasures back, must compensate us with other German planes, possibly from WW2, e.g., different types of Messershmitt, Junkers and Focke-Wuld planes which in my opinion are very exciting. Only then will I agree to the return. If not, I will lie down on the road to the Museum to stop the planes` departure. |
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Post by bescheid on Sept 8, 2007 14:59:36 GMT -7
Not to be difficult or split up the vote, I voted {different opinion}, but for other reasons.
For one thing, enough is enough! The war is over and done with. It has been so many years now, even the stink of the dead is no more.
In as much to cultural treasures, well, if in deed they are treasures, in the good care of the currant possessors, then be it so well. For cultural treasures are for the enlightenment of the people, for the enrichment of their senses and their pleasure in viewing. For this is what it is about, for the people.
If the possessors of our long past artifacts of war weapons is of value to the senses and important to the beholders, this is well and good. For other wise, those used up weapons are junk.
I do not agree with my country in demanding any thing so frivolous as war time booty return, for as mentioned, it is legal booty and should be considered as such, so to the beholder of this equipment, so be it fine.
If the question was of some particular examples of aerial weapons, well, I would not be so sure. For those things were not throughly tested and were very dangerous. If any of the residual fuel was left by accident in the sealed fuel tanks, any moisture would be a cause of some nasty accidents.
The Russians at present, are great collectors of our war time losses in combat equipment from the war. Even also of some very fine pre-war and post war vehicles, kept by collectors and properly restored. The Russians are smart though, they are selling the war time field capture arms to the Americans for hard cash as relics and memorabilia.
In effect, I am totally appalled at the frivolous nature of any demands made by my country, if in deed this is the situation as depicted by the news print. For it is an embarrassment and degradation of the prestige of my government and to all German people including my self.
Charles
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Pawian
European
Have you seen my frog?
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Post by Pawian on Sept 8, 2007 15:45:51 GMT -7
In as much to cultural treasures, well, if in deed they are treasures, in the good care of the currant possessors, then be it so well. Yes, they are taken good care of. Those German planes have been gradually reconstructed in the Museum, the result is amazing. There are still some which await renovation, including a flying wing of Otto Lilienthal. Yes, it is important, yet it is even more important for me to see a Focke Wulf 190 in the Polish Museum. That`s very noble of you. |
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Post by bescheid on Sept 8, 2007 17:29:36 GMT -7
In as much to cultural treasures, well, if in deed they are treasures, in the good care of the currant possessors, then be it so well. Yes, they are taken good care of. Those German planes have been gradually reconstructed in the Museum, the result is amazing. There are still some which await renovation, including a flying wing of Otto Lilienthal. Yes, it is important, yet it is even more important for me to see a Focke Wulf 190 in the Polish Museum. That`s very noble of you. What is your interest in the Fw 190 {Würger}?It was in the war years, a very remarkable invention of Professor-Kurt Tank, for it was a highly efficient machine for the time. Not sure exactly of the motor power, but believe it was in the top area of 1 176 kW. The cowling was the closed in design, with large centre cone, directing cooling air drawn in by an internal auxiliary kooling fan, further directing the ambient air flow over the double row motor cylinders. The aspect of this design was double in design. The air cooled the motor, and with the absorbed heat, expanded and expelled at higher velocity out the air exhaust producing in the process, added thrust. Charles |
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Pawian
European
Have you seen my frog?
Posts: 3,266
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Post by Pawian on Sept 9, 2007 0:22:32 GMT -7
What is your interest in the Fw 190 {Würger}?It was in the war years, a very remarkable invention of Professor-Kurt Tank, for it was a highly efficient machine for the time. It simply looks pretty..... |
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Post by pieter on Sept 9, 2007 2:20:16 GMT -7
I voted; No, Germany destroyed Poland and Polish heritage! I voted yes, on certain conditions. Germans can take their composers` manuscripts, I don`t need them . Currently these papers are hidden in basements of the Biblioteka Jagiellońska in Krakow and the public can`t see them anyway so I won`t lose much. hahahahaha There is a problem with planes. They are exhibited in the Museum of Aviation in Krakow close to my home. We often go there, the German planes from WW1 are displayed in a specially built hangar. I can agree to the return of these planes to Germany without broken heart because old planes never interested me too much. But Germans, if they want their flying treasures back, must compensate us with other German planes, possibly from WW2, e.g., different types of Messershmitt, Junkers and Focke-Wuld planes which in my opinion are very exciting. Only then will I agree to the return. If not, I will lie down on the road to the Museum to stop the planes` departure. Pawian, I have to say I was very amused by your humoristic and yet serious comment, you put a smile on my face on this sunday morning! Althought we do not agree I totally agree with your standpoint from the standpoint of freedom of expression, thought and vote. I stay behind mine and respect yours, I did not have many occasions that in a democratic point of view my "oponent" gave me this chance to be entertained. You stand in your right and we share a love for old and probably new planes, I love every occasion that I can go to Schiphol airport, because I love the International atmosphere and the Planes from all differant airlines! www.airliners.nl/Schiphol/schiphol_wannahaves.htmPieter |
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