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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:37:50 GMT -7
 A refugee camp in GreeceFolks,
I think that diplomatic, huge development aid, investments, military and Geopolitical means must be combined to stop refugee floods, waves of migrants to Europe and other Western countries. And therefor the West should make plans and might be willing to spend hundreds of billions of dollars/Euro's to change and transform poor, war/civil war ridden, and corrupt, nepotist and less democratic regions of the world. I am talking about Africa, the Middle East and Afghanistan.
What do you need? You need a huge International United Nations Peace Keeping Force, with in it UN Police forces, judicial people, development aid experts, top diplomats, and experienced Peace keeping people, and 'Area/region management' experts.
The Western Powers together with the Brics countries should negotiate 'Free and Safe zones in the Middle East and Africa', these countries should erect Modern, Humane, Refugee zones, with refugee camps with self supplying systems, sophisticated housing, infrastructure, education systems, a health care system, a sort of internal refugee camp democracy with a shared administration of United Nations and Refugee representatives. In this refugee camp system there should be a chain of refugee camps, with good water supplies, food, sanitation and hygiene, safety for women and girls, respect for human rights, sports facilities, Refugee camp universities, campuses, Research & Development centers, an agricultural system with farms and greenhouses, their own irrigation system, wells and a system to collect and store rain water if it falls.
Inside these refugee zones there should be a fair, strict and safe selection mechanism. Europe, the EU, the UK, Switzerland, Australia, New Zealand, the USA, Canada, Norway, Iceland, Israel, the Russian Federation, Ukraine, Belarus, Turkey, Egypt, Saoudi Arabia, China, Brazil, India, and South Africa should cooperate in this (I think in a Post-Ukraine War Future situation) and think about the Future of the World and thus the Globe. How do we create fair solutions for all. If we agree that all human beings are equal but not the same, we really should find solutions and start to work on them.
This military, diplomatically and financial-economical and geopolitical enforced Refugee area's in Africa and the Middle East, should have no fly zones. This United Nations armed force should be heavily armed with tanks, artillery, fighter yets, bombers, and a large force of soldiers, officers and experienced generals. The police force of this refugee zones should be manned by police officers of the united countries that make up the UN Peace keeping force.
Now what is Pieter's idea. I would make these Refugee centers, enclaves and economical asset for the regions or zones where they are located, so that the countries and regions benefit from their presence. How would you say? First the present of a huge military and police force creates economical opportunities for the locals (the non refugees and the refugees) because these people have to eat, relax and have maintainance of their houses, their military zone restaurants, shops, Mc Donalds, Burger King, Kentucky Fried Chicken, Piza Hut, Wall Mart stores (Super Markets) and etc.
These real refugees that can't go back to destroyed nations, destroyed towns, destroyed cities and hostile regimes that want to kill them because they have the wrong kind of ethnicity, race or affiliation have to be treated with respect, dignity and clearness. Safe landers must be sent back to where they came from. The selection must be tough and fair. The administrators and the questioners/interviewing civil servants whom have to judge them in the selection have to ask these people tough questions;
- Do you want to go back to your own country if this terrible oppressive regime is toppled? Do you have relatives or friends left there? Do you want to choose for your new host country for ever or do you prefer to stay there temorarily and after a while return to where you came from?
- What country do you want to go to? What do you think you can offer that country? Do you realise that that country has a different people, different religion, different history, different culture, and might have people who could be reserved, distant or hostile to you, because you are a non Western alien? Do you realise that you go to a different Continent, to a completely different world than the world that is known to you. Europe is not an Islamic continent, but a Christian Continent. Do You think you can live in a largely Christian, secular-humanist, Atheist and agnostic continent. Some things might shock you or disgust you? Are you aware of that?
- You have chosen for that country. Okay. Do you realize that in this Refugee zone you have to study hard, to work hard, to learn hard, to understand the country you are going to, to accept the customs and traditions of the country you are going to, the people of the country you are going to, and the rules, legislation, duties and laws of the country you are going too. Do you realise that you have to learn and study the language, and to become good at that language, before that country will let you in? We have every tool, every possibility for you to get to know the country you want to go to. We have documentaries, instruction video's, movies, people of these countries that can tell you about their country. You must realize that it will take a lot of effort from you in this refugee camp to adapt to the country you have chosen. Learn the history, learn the language, learn about the customs, learn about their traditions and try to get into contact with people of that country that are over here. Keep elements of your own culture, your authentic core, but in the same time become like a person of the country you want to go to. The better you speak the language and the better you are in a useful subject, profession or aim you have, the more you will have a chance to succeed in your new home country.
Folks I invented the inquiry above here, and the questions of the UN or EU interviewer. This is how I would do it. It is humane and it gives those refugees who are selected and allowed to go to Europe to integrate, assimilate and be successful in their New European Western country.
Again, I believe in such 'safe zones', 'sophisticated refugee camps' in area's/regions in Africa and the Middle East. And I believe that they shouldn't be advertised, promoted, but that these civilized refugee camps should be there to prevent the drowning dramas in the Mediterranean, and the dehydration dramas in the North African deserts and the gruesome death in mountains between Iran and Turkey, Iraq and Turkey, Syria and Turkey.
I know this is an idealistic plan and costs a lot of money, but the current situation is unsustainable and not preferable.
Cheers,
Pieterwww.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/13698230.2021.1941702 |
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:38:37 GMT -7
 People,
Suppose that certain Arab or North African countries, in exchange for renting territory, or lending part of their territory, benefit from foreign investment, and trade deals with these Refugee zone economies.
That, for example, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, Tunisia, Turkey, Morocco, Syria and Iraq allow 'Safe zones' with No Fly zones that are under international supervision and where the United Nations, the UNHCR (the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees), are responsible in cooperation with the EU, NATO, the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE), all the European countries, the USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, South Korea, China, Ukraine, Russia, India, Brazil, Mexico, Turkey, Israel and Norway.
This safe area with a no-fly zone, international human rights monitors, and a United Nations peacekeeping and police force, area and camp administration, camp border guards, UN diplomats, negotiators, lawyers, prosecutors and judges, UN camp courts and all mechanisms associated with a camp democracy would be a good place for refugees to stay.
On the one hand, the refugees are not free, but on the other hand, they invest in and prepare for a new life in the Netherlands, Germany, Belgium, Luxembourg, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Austria, the United Kingdom, Ireland, Spain, Italy, Portugal, Finland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Slovenia, Romania, Poland, Hungary, Malta, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Cyprus and Turkey.
I know that Poland and Hungary are against non-Western and Muslim immigrants and refugees.
But if refugees would come to Europe in the new Pieter system and be spread over all countries, then both the refugee problem would be less and at the same time the number of refugees per country would be less.
When refugees in the UNHCR new style refugee camp can be better selected (separated the wheat from the chaff), and would be trained for the countries they go to, then they will be better placed in the countries for which they have chosen or the countries for which they have been selected in the distribution policy of the EU and the EU countries. This better training and adoption to their new European settlement country would include exams in language, culture, history, customs, customs and the tradition of these countries. These refugees also will get lessons and lectures in the modern Western European society of the country to which they go to. The objections of the Poles and Hungarians would be less or will be less.
So according to the principle of equal monks, equal hoods, refugees are spread over all European countries and other Western countries.
These refugees have been screened in advance on origin, level of education, employment certificates, passports, driver's licenses, identity cards, their political past, family and the city, village or region they come from. Of course you have people of different ethnic, social, class, religious and professional backgrounds. You will have people from poorer rural backgrounds whom are illiterate and have in Western (European) eyes Medieval, Feudal, Honor Cultures ( en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honor_killing ), and you will have people whom come from cities with one million or more citizens or towns or urban agglomerations with tens of thousands of citizens, Primary schools, High schools and Universities. Tehran, Isfahan, Ahvaz, Bagdad, Mosul, Basra, Sulaymaniyah, Nasiriyah, Aleppo, Daraa, Homs, Kabul, Herat, Mazar-i-Sharif, Kandahar, Jalalabad, Lashkargah, Kunduz, and Taloqan.
There must be a sophisticated system in the camp in which as much information and knowledge as possible about these refugees can be collected. At the same time, representatives of the UNHCR or the UN in the countries of origin must be able to conduct research into the residence, life and occupations of the refugees.
It is very important that, in addition to Europe, other Western countries will also take in some of these refugees, in order to relieve the pressure on Europe.
I think that through my system, you will get motivated, highly educated, professionally trained refugees who have consciously chosen a country after their own research and study.
Europe as a whole will be different because each country will have multiple ethnicities and cultures. More than they already have. But the spread will be wider and better and if the countries see that they are getting motivated, integrated and partially assimilated refugees who add value to their economy and society, then they will agree to this new kind of refugees that are different from before.
These international refugee enclaves with multiple refugee camps will become regional and local economies in their own right. And if they bring prosperity to the North African and Middle Eastern host countries, they could be a model for the whole world.
Greeting,
Pieter |
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:39:11 GMT -7
 People,
I am really in favor of very humane treatment and the best facilities for these refugees in the reception in their own region and their thorough preparation for legal immigration to a European country or another non-European Western country.
I am in favor of having separate religious facilities for the refugees (to avoid conflict). So a mosque, church, Yezidi temple, cultural center for the refugees. Schools with good education for the children, whether in their own Arabic, African, Kurdish or Afghan - Dari Persian (spoken by the Pashtun and other Afghans),
Tajik, Hazara [Dari], Uzbek language, Aimaq, Turkmen languag a Baloch language) and the European language of the country they are going to (bilingual education is good for both children and the elderly), and libraries in the camp. You must also have theaters, cinemas, coffee houses and restaurants in the camp.
Life should go on as normally as possible and the camp should resemble an ordinary city, an ordinary town or at least an ordinary village.
You could call the camp a Republic and let the residents choose their own president and ministers and ministers for the camp board.
In addition, the camp should have its own laws and rules, be a constitutional state (in miniature), with a separation of powers (Trias Politica). The state exercises according to the valid law and a judiciary that checks this execution against the law.
In this way you could show the people in the refugee camp how a democracy works in practice.
Also with the rights and obligations that go with it and the law that you must comply with. So also with law enforcement, arresting criminals and incarcerating those criminals in a real camp prison. And these criminals can then take a lawyer from a lawyer's office out of the camp, just like in a real democracy.
The camp is perfectly organized, so the camp has its own schools, universities, adult education, places where you can follow courses, workshops and seminars.
For the camp democracy you will have to set up legal political parties and have them organized and staffed with refugees.
So I imagine in the camp you have a Conservative Party, a Labor Party, a Liberal Democrats, a Muslim Democratic Party, a Green Party and a Socialist Party (to the left of Labour).
You can create organizations for those political parties, grassroots movements, with departments, in different neighborhoods of a large camp, which you should see as a city (the camp itself). In it you have department boards with board members and working groups on various subjects.
Enthusiastic people can indulge in the party's house styles, program, ideology, and in making posters, flyers, websites, social media, videos and podcasts. They can orient themselves on the political parties of the countries they want to go to and already receive political training in the camp.
And so the camp must have a House of Representatives (Parliament) and a Senate, a government, president, prime minister, ministers and ministries. The camp could also have its own diplomats and officials who work within the larger Safe Zone/No Fly Zone UNHCR Refugee Zone or area with several large refugee camps (Republics) with other Refugee Republics (camps), with the host countries, the countries in the region and could have contact with European countries.
For example, refugees could be trained for local, regional and national politics as well as for international politics.
I would be very happy that within these Democratic Refugee Republics (camps) without official status as countries, but with some autonomy under the supervision of the UN, EU, Host and Western countries, there would be well-functioning economies, financial resources, some environmentally friendly Industry, camp agriculture, retail, a camp banking system with ATMs and cash (maybe even with its own camp currency), roads and highways between the camps, with bridges and viaducts over them. And within this economy a great diversity of products, production, marketing, sales, lease, rental, and services.
A scene from the crowded Za'atri refugee camp in Jordan hosting many Syrian refugees.
Always in such a way that it does not become too threatening to the local economy of the host country.
Trade and exchange with the local population and economy should also be possible in a peaceful manner. Then the host country and the population of the host country would also benefit from this economy that creates the refugee zone.
Everything in this refugee zone must be based on preparing these people as well as possible for life in a Western country. With foremost;
1) - Know who you are and where you come from, don't forget that.
2) - Adjust to your new environment, learn the language of the new country. Try to learn to speak it flawlessly. The better you speak it the better your future is.
3) - Get to know the history, the people, their customs, habits, traditions, rules and laws and stick to them.
4) - Get to know the modern society of the new country. Don't get stuck in your own culture with your own people. Join a football club, a bridge club, a drama club or a choir. This is how you get to know the people of your new country. Invite your neighbors and become friends with them.
All this I say only after a process of selection, in which the wheat is separated from the chaff, in which Safe landers are sent back to their home countries (Moroccans back to Morocco and Albanians back to Albania - in the case of a European refugee camp-) . And after a thorough investigation, rotten apples have also been removed from the camp and, for example, Islamic State supporters, Hezbollah supporters and known war criminals have been excluded from an asylum application.
In this way of screening, research into people's past and therefore strict selection, you remove the wrong people, and you ensure that only the good, only the real refugees enter Europe and are distributed across all countries.
I know that Poland and Hungary are against it, but the EU and Western European countries must be tough on Poland and Hungary. We are all members and the same qualifications, rules and agreements apply to everyone. It cannot be the case that only a few European countries take in all refugees and that they pay for all costs, the integration and/or assimilation process.
If, after a strict selection process, we distribute the real refugees, after a much better integration course, over all European countries and other Western countries, then each country will have a much smaller group that can be integrated much better and can be guided better.
I think even then you will have successful, patriotic, highly motivated new compatriots in these refugees.
In the Netherlands, look at the possible new leader of the largest political party, Dilan Yesilgöz-Zegerius, she is a successful example of an integrated former refugee. Her party is the conservative liberal VVD party of demissionary Prime Minster Mark Rutte of the Demissionary Caretaker Cabinet Rutte 4.
The Turkish Kurd Dilan Yesilgöz-Zegerius escaped to the Greek island of Kos in 1984 by boat, along with her mother and sister, at the age of 7. Later she became a refugee from there, getting asylum in the Netherlands. Her father, Yücel Yeşilgöz, a left-wing trade unionist, escaped from Turkey and sought asylum in the Netherlands in 1980, after the 1980 coup. Her mother is from a Turkish origin and her father is Kurdish and originally from Tunceli, located in the Eastern Anatolia Region of Turkey. Dilan Yesilgöz-Zegerius is certainly a Dutch Patriot and she is from the conservative rightwing of her party, the VVD, the other wing is the leftwing liberal wing of the VVD. Yesilgöz is rather strict on immigration and therefor not so popular in leftwing circles. Some migrant people call her a Bounty, White Native Dutch from the outside and Turkish from the inside. They don't like her either. She is not from my party, but I have to say that she was an excellent and hard working politician and today a hard working minister. She will probably be the new leader of the Conservative VVD.
Dilan Yeşilgöz-Zegerius (born 18 June 1977) is a Dutch politician who has served as Minister of Justice and Security in the Fourth Rutte cabinet since 10 January 2022. A member of the 'conservative-liberal' People's Party for Freedom and Democracy (VVD), she previously served as a member of the House of Representatives from 2017 to 2021 and State Secretary for Economic Affairs and Climate Policy from 2021 until 2022.
Cheers,
Pieter |
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:39:36 GMT -7
Folks,
For the refugee camp 'Republic' political structure I took the example from no less than the Polish Jewish educator, children's author and pedagogue Janusz Korczak ( Warsaw 22 July 1878 or 1879 – Treblinka extermination camp 7 August 1942).
Educator, children's author and pedagogue Janusz Korczak
In 1911–1912, Korczak became the director of Dom Sierot in Warsaw, an orphanage of his own design for Jewish children. He hired Stefania Wilczyńska as his assistant. There he formed a kind-of-a-republic for children with its own small parliament, court, and a newspaper.
Stefania "Stefa" Wilczyńska (26 May 1886 – 6 August 1942) was a Polish educator who was murdered in the Holocaust.
Janusz Korczak and Stefania Wilczyńska
Korczak has tried, through trial and error, to make his orphanage a just community. He had created some tools for this purpose, which were far ahead of their time, such as the children's parliament and the children's newspaper Little Revue. But the most experimental and up to that point without precedent was the so-called children's court in the orphanage. This court, consisting of children (pupils of the house), ruled when children had complaints about each other, for example, they had destroyed each other's belongings or had broken the windows. However, the most commonly imposed sanction was not punishment, but forgiveness and a request to the "defendant" to make amends. Korczak had written a law code with a large number of paragraphs of rulings. As the misbehavior became more serious, so did the sanction (i.e., the ruling was published on the bulletin board). The harshest punishment, Article 1000, meant that the pupil was removed from the orphanage. In the thirty years that the orphanage has existed, this sentence has only been handed down once. This indicates that Korczak took a huge interest in giving children a new chance to improve their behavior.
Pieter
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:40:15 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:40:39 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:41:04 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 9:41:48 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Jul 18, 2023 10:05:01 GMT -7
I would like to see refugee camps which are the opposite of this camp
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Post by pieter on Jul 19, 2023 6:33:50 GMT -7
Folks,
In this UNHCR refugee camps the EU, USA, Canada, UK, New Zealand, Australia, Amnesty International, Human Rights Warch, B'Tselem, the International Red Cross, Red Crescent Movement, Magen David Adom (Israel's national emergency medical, disaster, ambulance and blood bank service), Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF; Doctors Without Borders), the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA; the successor to the Office of the United Nations Disaster Relief Coordinator (UNDRO), UNICEF, the World Food Programme, the International Rescue Committee, Catholic Relief Services (CRS; the international humanitarian agency of the Catholic community in the United States), CARE (Cooperative for Assistance and Relief Everywhere), Americares, Direct Relief, World Vision International, Save The Children, the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) and the United States Agency for International Development (USAID) should have access, a monitor position and thus they must be able to control and judge about the human rights conditions, human living conditions and the Freedom, prosperity and development position of the refugees in these camps. Also Western democratic parliamentarians (Politicians) should be able to visit the camps, speak with the refugees and monitor what is going on in these UNHCR refugee camps. My (Pieter's) plan for these UNHCR refugee camps is completely different than the present existing UNHCR refugee camps. Again, like I said it will cost a lot of budget (Billions of dollars), a large UN Peace keeping force and international police officers, civil servants, development aid experts, experienced destination managers, construction workers and firms that build these modern camps, infrastructure and fences, watch towers, and boarder walls, roads, highways, bridges, schools, universities, hospitals, public transportation facilities within these camps and public buildings. Safety and securityI think that the safety of children, especially little girls and teenage girls, and the safety of women should be better guarded and protected in these camps. Because I heard stories about unsafe situations, assault, rape, human trafficking, exploitation, imbalance between ethnic groups and serious conflicts between ethnic groups. That should not exist, should be stopped and can also be undone by new better refugee camps, with more space (area), more facilities, and for example a better separation of those nationalities, ethnicities and peoples that come into conflict with each other. For example Eriteans and Syrians, Iraqis and Somalis, Kurds and Arabs and etc.
You have to create more humane conditions by building better camps, with simple but decent houses instead of tents, buildings with apartments, clean streets, sewers, good sanitary facilities, sports and playgrounds for the children and young people so that they do not get bored.
It remains a refugee camp zone with a No Fly zone, UN Peace Keeping troops who guard the camps and UN police who ensure order, security and peace within the camps, and UN courts, judges, prosecutors and lawyers who monitor the justice system inside these camps.
In my ideal of an autonomous refugee camp zone, you have an area with a border within the national borders of the country where the refugee zone is. Within this zone you have a number of large and a number of smaller Refugee camps.
And for the security of the host country's residents, the outer border of this zone is guarded by mixed teams of UN soldiers, UN customs officers and UN police officers together with police officers from the country where the 'Zone' is located (similar to Unifil in Lebanon and UNDOF on the border between Syria and Israel on the Golan Heights), e.g. Jordan, Lebanon, the border area of Turkey and Syria (In Syria), Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Morocco and, for example, Turkey.
Why would these countries want to participate in this you will ask? Firstly, because these countries will earn from it. The UN and many Western countries that want to contain the flow of refugees to their countries will have to pay for those Refugee Zones containing the Refugee camps. They will have to rent or lease the territory of these refugee camps from the countries on which the refugee camps are build and located.
Secondly, these countries would benefit from more order, security, less misery, poverty and problems around those refugee camps. Ethnic tensions between local Arabs, Berbers and other natives on the one hand and refugees on the other would decrease.
Look at Lebanon and Jordan and Turkey where you still have ethnic tensions between natives and the refugee masses. This new refugee camp system would reduce those tensions. A prerequisite for this is a Status Aparte, an autonomous position, and national and international recognition of these autonomous refugee areas in Northern Syria, Turkey, Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt, Libya, Tunisia and other countries where these refugee zones could be located.
For example Saudi Arabia, Algeria, Rwanda, The United Arab Emirates, Oman and Israel.
Israel will protest, because that country is terrified of an Arab majority, because "Jewish democracy" requires a Jewish majority. I understand that and I don't think it's racist, but ethnic, cultural, historical and religious folk thinking.
This whole story about refugee camps in the region, to keep more refugees in their own region, also comes from a native European ethnic, cultural, historical and religious folk thinking.
Within these camps with refugees of Arab origin, you could also discuss the possibility of choosing an Arab country in a region where there is no threat of war, civil war or terror. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, the United Arab Emirates or Qatar would also be good destinations for Sunni Arab refugees from Syria or Iraq, for example.
Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, the United Arab Emirates or Qatar themselves would benefit from highly educated refugees from these camps who speak fluent Arabic.
Saudi Arabia wants to build new modern cities in the North close to Jordan, Israel and Egypt. The country needs new residents, employees and entrepreneurs for this.
Perhaps a few Syrian and Iraqi refugees would be willing to become Saudis and residents of this new city Neom. The “City of the Future” NeomNeom (styled NEOM; Arabic: نيوم, romanized: Niyūm, Hejazi pronunciation: [nɪˈjo̞ːm]) is a new urban area planned by the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia to be built in its northwestern Tabuk Province. The site is north of the Red Sea, east of Egypt across the Gulf of Aqaba and south of Jordan. The total planned area of Neom is 26,500 km2 (10,200 sq mi). The city's plans include multiple regions, including a floating industrial complex, global trade hub, tourist resorts and a linear city—all powered exclusively by renewable energy sources. It was launched by Saudi Crown Prince and Prime Minister Mohammed bin Salman.  Pieter
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Post by pieter on Jul 19, 2023 7:28:05 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on Jul 19, 2023 9:07:21 GMT -7
Two side of the coin The other sideFolks,
With the political situation in Europe and the Netherlands becoming increasingly unsustainable, measures must be taken. The Dutch cabinet fell, and now the refugee problem, migration, integration, the shortage of houses in the Netherlands for natives, migrants and 'admitted refugees', the 'Nitrogen' discussion, Global heating, the War in Ukraine and Ukrainian refugees, and new waves of African, Middle Eastern and Afghan refugees that might come our way, despite the recent Tunesia deal of the EU, Netherlands and Italy with Tunesia (read the other thread; jagahost.proboards.com/thread/24529/rutte-leyen-meloni-again-tunisia ). The current difficult situation makes a new appeal to the current caretaker cabinet, the successor of this cabinet and within the European context to the European Commission and all European Member States, but also Norway, the United Kingdom, the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Korea, Japan and Taiwan. You have to define the Western as a power bloc, and really turn it into a power bloc. And with a membership of that power bloc come rights and obligations. Also regarding refugees, migrants, migration, integration programs and international contributions to UNHCR refugee camps.
My Dutch Leftist (Socialist Party, GreenLeft, Party of the Animals, Denk [Think], Bij1), Center Left (PvdA & D66), Center right (VVD & CDA) friends will not happy with my following statement and opinion. I think that the whole political spectrum since 911 (11 September 2001), the murders on Pim Fortuyn and Theo van Gogh, and the death threats against politicians from left and right since 2005 (Geert Wilders, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Sigrid Kaag and Caroline van der Plas) has changed not only the political climate and the political landscape, but moved the whole political spectrum in the Netherlands to the right. In the near future Rightwing populist movements like the BBB (Farmer Citizens Movement; de Boer Burger Beweging) and JA21 might be part of a coalition government. Let's say a BBB, VVD, CDA and JA21 coalition administration. That would be the most rightwing government we have had since the Second World War.
Anyhow, decisions have to made today and in the very near future to deal with the refugee crisis and migration. If you really want to keep the refugees in their own region, then you have to do something about that and not just shout anti-immigration/anti-refugee slogans from the sidelines or Pro-immigration/Pro-refugees slogans.
Despite the differences, Dutch political parties from the left and right agree that refugees should integrate in the Netherlands. I think the same is the case in other West-European countries.
It will be the same in other European countries with many migrants and refugees. Countries like Germany and Sweden.
Things have to change and something has to be done, that is clear. My proposal above in this thread is a serious system of shelter in the region through a joint approach of the United Nations and the European countries, and in any case the United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. The West must act jointly in this regard. All Western countries have migration and refugee problems, but also successfully integrated migrants. You have to see if you can learn from each other's successes, but also from each other's mistakes.
Greeting,
Pieter
Arnhem
The Netherlands |
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Post by pieter on Jul 19, 2023 10:01:17 GMT -7
P.S.- My hope and desire is that the BBB and JA21 in the Netherlands will develop themselves as reasonable, Rightwing, conservative, Patriotic, non-racist, non-xenophobe, non-antisemitic rightwing political parties and movements. In our pillarised Dutch political history we didn't had a real conservative movement, because our pillars (Dutch: zuilen) system based on Pillarisation had 4 main pillars; 1) Protestant Christian, 2) Roman Catholic, 3) Lineral (Classical liberal, Progressive liberal and conservative liberal parties) and 4) the Social Democrats, also called Socialists (the Dutch Labour Party). I hope thus that from the BBB and JA21 a conservative Dutch movement will grow based on ideas of Edmund Burke, Thomas Hobbes, Alexis de Tocqueville, the Dutch politician Frits Bolkestein, the conservative elements of Pim Fortuyn and maybe some basic fundaments of Johan Rudolph Thorbecke (14 January 1798 – 4 June 1872), a Dutch liberal statesman, one of the most important Dutch politicians of the 19th century. In this the BBB and JA21 move in another direction than Geert Wilders Freedom Party and Thierry Baudets Forum for Democracy, which are Far right, Nationalist, National conservative, xenophobe and racist political parties.
JA21 is a rightwing, conservative, conservative liberal, and rather anti-immigration, Euroscepitc and a Fortuynist political party, but less extreme than the PVV and Forum For Democracy. Why do I write about this internal Dutch politics you might ask? Because it is important for our domestic and foreign policies, migration and refugee policies. The same counts for present day Germany. It is different if the present government coalition governs Germany or a future Alternative für Deutschland-CDU/CSU government coalition. These internal domestic political situations of the EU memnber states are important for our future Immigration or Refugee policies.
Pieter
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Post by karl on Jul 19, 2023 15:47:17 GMT -7
Pieter
My self must applaud your proposals in solving the immigration situation. For this is a powder keg needing only a lighted fuse to blow up, for if not, then the pubic will devise their own means that would not benefit anyone nor bring resolution to this issue.
Karl
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