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Post by Jaga on Dec 5, 2005 10:39:42 GMT -7
These of you who watched the movie about the pope on CBS yesterday should recall the procession with empty frames. What was this about? Does anybody know the historical background what caused people to do a procession with no picture but the empty frames with no picture inside?
I know a bit but I wanted first to check whether you understood this scene...
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Post by hollister on Dec 5, 2005 11:20:32 GMT -7
As there was a ban on public displays of religious objects - they removed the picture of the Black Madonna and proceeded to have the procession with the empty frame. It was an example of obeying the literal interpetation of the law but showing the powers that be that - they couldn't stop people's faith and belief and the people were resisting in any way they could. The upshot was that the authories that thought that then, Fr. Wotlya was simply and intellectual and young was a force to be considered and was not going to simply take what he was told and let that be that. He was going to find ways to continue in his work and making his faith live on in Poland. I probably am not explaining this well.
My question - the fellow in the workshop that he goes to before the procession - is he now the Archbishop of Krakow? The character not the actor.
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nancy
European
Posts: 2,144
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Post by nancy on Dec 5, 2005 12:02:51 GMT -7
I thought the same as Hollister - that those very smart Poles had a procession according to the rituals of their faith but avoided breaking the law because they did not actually carry the icon.
I had not heard of this example before - did it really happen? I loved it.
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Post by Jaga on Dec 5, 2005 13:53:27 GMT -7
The copy of Black Madonna picture was literally arested by communistic governments. THe couple of copies were going to circulate in different diocesis during the anniverary of the thousands years of Polish christianity.... when communists arrested the copy the church decide to go ahead with the processions with the empty frames here is more about it in Polish: www.miesiecznik.jasnagora.pl/2003/luty_03/2_perygrynacja.htm |
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Post by gardenmoma on Dec 5, 2005 22:53:04 GMT -7
Wotlya remarks to his subordinate / curate There is a ban against parading religious objects in public, but no ban on simple religious procession. Then later watching the procession with the empty frame, one of the administrative characters in the movie remarked If one is going to play with a cat, one must be prepared to be scratched.. Loved those lines!  |
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Post by Jaga on Dec 6, 2005 21:55:56 GMT -7
Wotlya remarks to his subordinate / curate There is a ban against parading religious objects in public, but no ban on simple religious procession. Then later watching the procession with the empty frame, one of the administrative characters in the movie remarked If one is going to play with a cat, one must be prepared to be scratched.. Loved those lines! Yes, very good phrases - but the procession with empty frames was not just for the sake of procession. It was connected with the fact that the copy of Black Madonna picture was just... imrpisoned. |
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Post by gardenmoma on Dec 7, 2005 7:18:30 GMT -7
Jaga, or anyone else...
Black Madonna...imprisioned in reality during those times - was the monastery at Jasna Gora available to the "common people" or was the basilica / chapel closed?
Or was the imprisionment figurative - symbolising the attitude of the Soviets on religion in general, specifically R. Catholicism?
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Post by Jaga on Dec 7, 2005 19:56:42 GMT -7
Jaga, or anyone else... Black Madonna...imprisioned in reality during those times - was the monastery at Jasna Gora available to the "common people" or was the basilica / chapel closed? Or was the imprisionment figurative - symbolising the attitude of the Soviets on religion in general, specifically R. Catholicism? the real picture was there in Czestochova but the copies that were made for procession around Poland were really imprisoned... this almost sound hilarious for us now....but this was not that funny in that times |
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