West Slavs

[pieter]

West Slavs

The West Slavs are Slavic peoples speaking West Slavic languages. They include Poles, Kashubians, Silesians, Czechs, Slovaks, Lusatian Sorbs (als called Wends) and the historical Polabians. The northern or Lechitic group includes, along with Polish, the Kashubian and extinct Polabian and Pomeranian languages. The languages of Upper and Lower Lusatia have features in common with both the Lechitic and the Czecho-Slovak group.
Culturally, West Slavs developed along the lines of other Western European nations due to affiliation with the Roman Empire and Western Christianity. Thus, they experienced a cultural split with the other Slavic groups: while the East Slavs and most South Slavs converted to Orthodox Christianity, thus being culturally influenced by the Byzantine Empire, the West Slavs along with the westernmost South Slavs (Slovenes and Croats) converted to Roman Catholicism, thus coming under the cultural influence of the Latin Church. (Rarely, the term "West Slavs" includes these Catholic South Slavs.)


Reconstruction of the Slavic temple in Groß Raden

History

In the Middle Ages the name Wends (probably following Venedi or Venedae, taken from Jordanes and Tacitus) was applied to Western Slavic peoples, most often those living in the Holy Roman Empire. Mieszko I, the first historical ruler of Poland, also appeared as "Dagome, King of the Wends".
The early Slavic expansion began in the 5th century, and by the 6th century, the groups that would become the West, East and South Slavic groups had probably become geographically separated. The first independent West Slavic states originate beginning in the 7th century, with the Empire of Samo (623 - 658), the Principality of Moravia (8th c. - 833), the Principality of Nitra (8th c. - 833) and Great Moravia (833 - c. 907). The Sorbs and other Polabian Slavs like Obodrites and Veleti came under the domination of the Holy Roman Empire after *the Wendish Crusade in the Middle Ages and had been strongly Germanized by Germans at the end of the 19th century. The Polabian language survived until the beginning of the 19th century in what is now the German state of Lower Saxony. To this day survived only 60.000 of Sorbs living predominantly in Lusatia, a region on the territory of modern Germany in the states of Brandenburg and Saxony.
The central Polish tribe of the Polans created their own state in the 10th century under the Polish duke Mieszko I. For many centuries Poland has had close ties with its western neighbors, with the Polish ruler Bolesław I the Brave declared by Holy Roman Emperor Otto III as Frater et Cooperator Imperii ("Brother and Partner in the Empire").
The precursors of the Czechs (i.e. Bohemians) migrated into Bohemia in the late 6th century and had established various fiefdoms by the 10th century when their rulers eventually became vassals (1002) of the Holy Roman Emperors. The Kingdom of Bohemia stayed part of that Empire between 1002–1419 and 1526–1918. The Predecessors of the Slovaks came under Hungarian domination after 907 (doom of the Great Moravia) – together with other Slavic groups as Croats, Slovenians, Dalmatians and Rusyns. Both the Czechs and the Slovaks were under rule of the Habsburg monarchy from 1526 to 1804; then in the Austrian Empire and between 1867–1918 part of Austria-Hungary.


West Slavs (light green) on the map of Europe.

Source: Encyclopedia Wikipedia

[pieter]

The early Polish state (Western-slav roots)

The terms Poland and Poles appear for the first time in medieval chronicles of the late 10th century. The land that the Poles, a West Slavic people, came to inhabit was covered by forests with small areas under cultivation where clans grouped themselves into numerous tribes. The dukes (dux) were originally the commanders of an armed retinue (drużyna) with which they broke the authority of the chieftains of the clans, thus transforming the original tribal organization into a territorial unit. Two tribes, the Polanie—based around the fortified settlement (castrum) of Gniezno—and the Wiślanie—who lived near Kraków—expanded to bring other tribes under their control.

Exposed to some missionary activities linked with St. Methodius, the state of Wiślanie fell under the rule of Great Moravia—which was destroyed by the Magyar invasion of the early 10th century—and came eventually under the rule of Mieszko I, the first ruler of the Polanie to be mentioned in written records. He is regarded as the founder of the Piast dynasty, the beginnings of which are clouded in legend, though the names of three of his predecessors are known. Creating what a contemporary Spanish-Jewish traveler, Ibrāhīm ibn Yaʾḳūb, described as the most powerful of the existing Slav states, Mieszko accepted Roman Catholicism via Bohemia in 966. A missionary bishopric directly dependent on the papacy was established in Poznań. This was the true beginning of Polish history, for Christianity was a carrier of Western civilization with which Poland was henceforth associated.

Facing the crucial problem of Poland’s relationship to the two pillars of medieval Christendom, the Germanic Holy Roman Empire and the papacy, Mieszko battled the expansive tendencies of the former—a record that dates from 963 refers to a struggle with the German dukes—while he sought reliance on Rome, to which he subordinated his state in a curious document, the Dagome iudex (c. 991). Poland alternately competed and cooperated with neighbouring Bohemia and Hungary as well as with the principality of Kievan Rus. At Mieszko’s death the Polish state stretched from the Baltic Sea to the Carpathian Mountains, resembling in shape post-World War II Poland.

Source: Encyclopedia Britannica

[pieter]

The Slavic people

Slav, member of the most numerous ethnic and linguistic body of peoples in Europe, residing chiefly in Central-, Eastern and southeastern Europe but extending also across northern Asia to the Pacific Ocean. Slavic languages belong to the Indo-European family. Customarily, Slavs are subdivided into East Slavs (chiefly Russians, Ukrainians, and Belarusians), West Slavs (chiefly Poles, Czechs, Slovaks, and Wends, or Sorbs), and South Slavs (chiefly Serbs, Croats, Bosnians, Slovenes, Macedonians, and Montenegrins). Bulgarians, though of mixed origin like the Hungarians, speak a Slavic language and are often designated as South Slavs. ( www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/84067/Bulgar )

In religion, the Slavs traditionally divided into two main groups: those associated with the Eastern Orthodox Church (Russians, most Ukrainians, most Belarusians, Serbs, and Macedonians) and those associated with the Roman Catholic Church (Poles, Czechs, Slovaks, Croats, Slovenes, some Ukrainians, and some Belarusians). The division is further marked by the use of the Cyrillic alphabet by the former (but including all Ukrainians and Belarusians) and the Latin alphabet by the latter. There are also many minority religious groups, such as *Muslims, Protestants (Calvinist, Lutheranians and Evangelicals), and Jews, agnostic people and atheists or secular-humanists. In recent times communist governments’ official encouragement of atheism, together with a general trend toward secularism, has eroded membership in the traditional faiths.

The original habitat of the Slavs is still a matter of controversy, but scholars believe they populated parts of eastern Europe. They entered the historical record about the 6th century ce, when they expanded westward into the country between the Oder and the Elbe-Saale line, southward into Bohemia, Moravia, Hungary, and the Balkans, and northward along the upper Dnieper River. When the migratory movements had ended, there appeared among the Slavs the first rudiments of state organizations, each headed by a prince with a treasury and defense force, and the beginning of class differentiation.

In the centuries that followed, there developed scarcely any unity among the various Slavic peoples. The cultural and political life of the West Slavs as well as that of the Slovenes and coastal Croatians was integrated into the general European pattern. They were influenced largely by philosophical, political, and economic changes in the West, such as feudalism, humanism, the Renaissance, the Reformation, the French Revolution, and the Industrial Revolution. As their lands were invaded by Mongols and Turks, however, the Russians and Balkan Slavs remained for centuries without any close contact with the European community; they evolved a system of bureaucratic autocracy and militarism that tended to retard the development of urban middle classes and to prolong the conditions of serfdom. The state’s supremacy over the individual tended to become more firmly rooted.

A faint kind of Slavic unity sometimes appeared. In the 19th century Pan-Slavism developed as a movement among intellectuals, scholars, and poets, but it rarely influenced practical politics. The various Slavic nationalities conducted their policies in accordance with what they regarded as their national interests, and those policies were as often bitterly hostile toward other Slavic peoples as they were friendly toward non-Slavs. Even political unions of the 20th century, such as that of Yugoslavia, were not always matched by feelings of ethnic or cultural accord, nor did the sharing of communism after World War II necessarily provide more than a high-level political and economic alliance.

*
www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/584107/Tatar (P.S.- Muslim Tartar minorities live in Poland and Lithuania where they have their typical Green wooden mosques. They are assimilated people, and their ancesters were soldiers for the Polish and the Lithuanian armies)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomaks / pomaknews.com/en/?p=217
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosniaks

Source: Encyclopedia Britannica

[Jaga]

Pieter, this is a great map and information. It looks that the most advanced Slavic people lived in what is today Eastern Germany. We met some Lusatian Sorbs since during the economical crisis in 80s one Catholic priest made our address available (among with other people) so that people would be able to send us food. cloths . We did not know about it, but we started receiving food packages from Eastern Germany. My mom kept in touch and sent these people letters and small gifts also and they reciprocated.

We were able to share good German coffee (which was almost impossible to get then) with our other family and friends. My parents went to visit these people in Easter. We had so many wonderful family pictures, Eastern Germany actually cultivated their regional Slavic traditions, they had their dancing club etc..... but after unification many people left to the West, so the villages are almost empty.

I lost touch with these families since my mom and dad kept tight relationhips but they are gon.e....

[kaima]

In the first posting the quotation "The Kingdom of Bohemia stayed part of that Empire between 1002–1419 and 1526–1918." cannot be accurate. Well, it is Wikipedia, and traditional encyclopedias had their own troubles with accuracy/


The Holy Roman Empire was killed, put to rest, extinguished by Napoleon in 1806.

Recently some friends and neighbors had me join them in watching a lecture series on the history of Hitler. The DVD's are available from some company sending out expensive lectures on many topic, given by presumably quite reputable professors and specialists in their fields.

My greatest disappointment was with the lecturer's careless choice of wording, wording that could easily lead to false implications. My neighbors never said anything, but I also criticized about three places in the series where the lecturer mis-stated events or was quite careless in his time reference, once even contradicting himself.

But then we can see why the need for precision in presentation is necessary, as in this case, where the Empire expired in 1806 and it would have been impossible for the Czechs to be a part of it until 1918.

PS> It seems they use the word "Kingdom of Germany" quite often in Wiki, but again I would argue Germany did not exist as a unit until 1871. But digging further in their writings of the Holy Roman Empire and the German Kingdom, I see the terms are rather flexible. Early on the Kingdom of Germany included the eastern section of the Frankish lands and extended down to Rome No mention is made of Prussia, the lesser states, or Bavaria, and Bavaria rather had its own king who did not claim to be King of Germany. Having two kings seems rather an odd concoction, as well as the same term being used for various minor states that claimed it for so long.

So is history. Hungarian history is even more of a conflicting fantasy.

[pieter]

Kaima,

You are so correct, and I am ashamed with my historical backrground (history art teacher student and a life long deep interest in history) I couldn't see that mistake. Wikipedia contradicts itself when you look at their Holy Roman Empire page ( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire_of_the_German_Nation )

Like you so correctly state the "Kingdom of Germany" means Kingdom of East Francia which came after the partitition of Charles the Great Frankish Empire (3rd century–843) in the Early Middle ages.

Divided empire, post-840

Charlemagne had several sons, but only one survived him. This son, Louis the Pious, followed his father as the ruler of a united empire. But sole inheritance remained a matter of chance, rather than intent. When Louis died in 840, the Carolingians adhered to the custom of partible inheritance, and after a brief civil war between the three sons, they made an agreement in 843, the Treaty of Verdun, which divided the empire in three:

Charlemagne or Charles the Great, a powerful, intelligent, and modestly literate figure who became a legend for the later history of both France and Germany. Charlemagne restored an equal balance between emperor and pope. I saw his Golden statue in the cathedral of Aachen as a kid when we went on a trip to Germany from our Belgian Ardens mountains holiday house.


Golden statue of Charles the Great in the Cathedral of Aachen (his palace chapel at Aachen, Germany, to be exactly)

[pieter]

To my knowledge the first sign of an un unified entity of Germany was established after the French defeat in the Franco-Prussian War (19 July 1870 – 10 May 1871), the German Empire was proclaimed in 1871 in Versailles, uniting all scattered parts of Germany except Austria (Kleindeutschland, or "Lesser Germany"). Before that Germany consisted of many smaller and bigger princedoms. Following the fall of Napoleon, the Congress of Vienna convened in 1814 and founded the German Confederation (Deutscher Bund), a loose league of 39 sovereign states.



Do you see how large the Kingdom of Hungary was back then. I did not know that Austria and Hungary were separate entities back then, because I always thought about the Austrian-Hungarian Habsburg double monarchy.

Read about the end of the Habsburg Empire: www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/44183/Austria/33376/End-of-the-Habsburg-empire

The hostilities of World War I were ended by an armistice signed on Nov. 3, 1918. The Austro-Hungarian high command, which had blundered into the war unprepared in 1914, did little better at its conclusion. Owing to inaccuracies in the wording of the documents, more than 300,000 Austro-Hungarian soldiers were taken prisoner by the Italian army.

For some days, the government hoped that, in spite of the secession of the Slav areas, the Habsburg dynasty could survive in the remaining lands. But even the German Austrians had lost faith in the Habsburgs, and, with revolutionary agitation on the rise and republican passion widespread, Charles adhered to the advice of Lammasch and decided to waive his rights to exercise political authority. On Nov. 11, 1918, he issued a proclamation acknowledging “in advance the decision to be taken by German Austria” and stating that he relinquished all part in the administration of the state. The declaration of November 11 marks the formal dissolution of the Habsburg monarchy.

Austro-Hungarian Dual Monarchy (1867 - 1918)

Austria-Hungary, also called Austro-Hungarian Empire or Austro-Hungarian Monarchy, byname Dual Monarchy, German Österreich-Ungarn, Österreichisch-Ungarisches Reich, Österreichisch-Ungarische Monarchie, or Doppelmonarchie, the Habsburg empire from the constitutional Compromise (Ausgleich) of 1867 between Austria and Hungary until the empire’s collapse in 1918.

[Jaga]

Pieter, this info is very interesting, I always wanted to know as much as possible about Western Slavs.

Kai, is there any relation between the words "Bohemia" and "bohema" or "boheme"?

[pieter]

Jaga,

It was interesting to read about the contact of your parents with these East-German Lusatian Sorbs during the economical crisis in 80s and that these people helped your parents. There must have been a sort of West-Slav solidarity. How unfortunately that you have lost contact with these people.
Unfortunately there is not so much information available about Western-Slavs on the internet.

Cheers,
Pieter

[Jaga]

Pieter,
there might be more info in German. During 80s the relationships between Poles and people who lives in Eastern or Western Germany improved a lot.
I do not want to call Lusitsian Germans. I feel that Lusitsian sense of regional bond is lost due to the unification, people move for jobs. Well, this is life. Some things change for good, some change for bad. Communism actually helped Lusitsian to preserve their culture by supporting their regional traditions.

Referring to Germans
We just do not think about Germans as bad occupiers or Nazi, but like the neighbors who helped us in bad times.