The Europe of the native Europeans

[pieter]

Folks,

In a time of neo-conservatism, Euroscepsis, Brexit, anti-multiculturalism, nativism, and a time in which people try to find their identity, belonging, roots, heritage, background, soil, culture, religion, people, nation or the group they belong to, the idea of the Europe of European nations of native European peoples comes up in rightwing national populist circles, nationalist circles and certain conservative circles. These people point at the Europe of the Germanic, Latin Romanesque, Slavic, Celtic, Basque, Hungarian, Greek and Baltic peoples.

For a long time this was taboo as racist, xenophobe, discriminatory and excluding. But today next to the old Neo-Nazi's, Neo-fascists and Neo-Phalangists you have normal 'Nationalists', 'National conservatives', New 'Rightwing National Populists', Identitarians, Alt Right (Europe), traditionalists, Monarchists and Orthodox Christians speaking about it. It is as if these neo-Nationalists, Neo-Monarchists, National Patriots are speaking about a Native White Europe of Germans, Austrians, Swiss people, Hungarians, Poles, Slovaks, Czechs, Baltic people, Scandinavians, Anglo-Saxon and Celtic Brits and Irish, latin Spanish, French, Portugese, Italian, Basque and Greek people without Muslim migrants, without Black Africans, without Turks, without Asians and without Jews.

This concept of Europe of the European nations and European peoples is anti-EU, anti-Brussels, anti-Democratic political establishment, anti-the Financial-economical elite (because that elite is internationalist, cosmopolitan and progressive liberal), anti-tolerance, anti-migrants, anti-refugees, anti-minorities (Sinti- and Roma, people with color from the former European colonies abroad and anti-Jewish, because Jews are seen as an alien element in the Pagan and Christian white native European peoples).

Increasingly I hear native Europeans say in conversations when there are troubles like unemployment, housing shortage, small crime and organised crime, degradation and deterioration of old working class neighbourhoods, human trafficking, prostitution, aggression and violence on the street, vandalism and intimidation, that in their point of view all that problems come from foreigners, guestworkers, migrants and refugees. In other words in the Dutch context Moroccans, Turks, Somalians, Sudanese, Eritreans, Ethiopians, Nigerians, Algerians, Tunesians, Syrians, Iraqi's, Albanians, Kosovars, and other non-Western groups.

Even if I point at Dutch organised crime, the problems in the native Dutch underclass often the conversations shifts to 'the foreigners', 'the migrants', 'the refugees'. The answer of a native Dutch lady I spoke with; "We have waiting lists for a new rented home for our children and they (the refugees) get homes (apartments) from the government." Other opinions about migrants and refugees from Compatriots of mine; They cause trouble, they are loud, they are unreliable, they are different, they hate us, they refuse to integrate, they refuse to assimilate, they are alien. What are they doing here, why are they here, why does the government doesn't sent them back.

You see ethnocentric, racial, ethnic, social cultural, localist, regionalist, nationalist, group thinking, Pan this Pan that (Scandinavians as a group, Germanic peoples as a group -Pan-Germanism, the latin peoples as a group Pan-Latinism , the Slavic peoples as a group -Pan-Slavism-, the Baltic people as a group, the Hungarians as a group, the Basque people as a group, the Greeks as a group, the Celtic people as group -The Irish, the Scots, the Welsh people, the Celtic French people from Bretagne -Brittany- and Normandy at the French West coast) and little empathy, understanding or fondess of what is alien, different and from abroad.

Probably that is in the animalistic nature of human beings. We belong to Human family clans, tribes and peoples. Are we very different than our Germanic and Slavic Pagan polytheist tribal ancestors Jaga, Ron, Karl, John, Jeanne, Ludwik and Eric? We over and over determine ourselves, place ourselves in groups and keep searching who are our allies and who are our friends, who are our arch rivals and who are our pals.

Europe in the near future will be a large space with Islands, Peninsula, regions, territories and ethnic ghetto's and reserves. Old native European rural agrarian area's, suburban urban agglomatations in the periphery of the large cities with a Cosmopolitan, Western, secular humanist and atheist population, ethnic Turkish, Arab, Berber, Kurd, Afghan, Somalian, Black African (Nigerian, Ghanese, Congolese, Sudanese) islands inside the larger cities, Muslim ghetto's or hoods and next to these ethnic white working class and middle class neighbourhoods which will be islands and peninsula as well. We have what we call 'White schools' (with white native European children) and 'Black schools' (with migrant children) in the Netherlands.

That is a quite wrong development these white schools and black schools in the same cities and towns, it points at segregation, separation and thus the fact that there is no contact between the children from the Black schools and the white schools, who also live in different neighbourhoods.

This is a negative and pessimist story, a dark story and a gloomy prediction of the future, but it is a fact. Not everything is as black and white as these people I spoke with see things, but it is their perception, their point of view, their opinion, and also their vote (Geert Wilders or Thierry Baudet?).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geert_Wilders
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thierry_Baudet

People should put things into perspective and look critical at their own people, children and teenagers as well. But people are people and thus they want to see what they want to see and think what they want to think. And some of them thus think that all problems come from the non-native Europeans, from the people from North-Africa, Turkey, the Middle East, Africa and Asia. politicians should reform the system and communities should put more effort in getting to know each other. Both sides blame the other for things, both sides have things that are true and both sides exaggerate, put things out of proportion, and both sides have their fears, anxieties, frustrations, irritations, rage, fury, disappointments, hurt, sadness, nostalgia and melancholy. Bot sides want the best for themselves, their parents, children and grandchildren.

But the road to that aim or goal seems to be different. The causes of that are ancient. Different heritages, ethnicities, races, religions, educations, histories, heritages, roots, backgrounds, political affiliations, professions, social classes, languages, dialects, cultures, family situations, nations, peoples and tribes. We will always be stuck to the Babylonian confusion and the fact that God made us different from each other. And thus discord, antithesis, conflict, war, civil war, terrorism, organised crime, hatred, opposing and fighting each other as human beings will stay with us until the end of times.

Cheers,
Pieter

[pieter]

[pieter]

[pieter]

[pieter]

The difference between racism and ethnocentrism



Although they are easily and often confused, race and racism must be distinguished from ethnicity and ethnocentrism. While extreme ethnocentrism may take the same offensive form and may have the same dire consequences as extreme racism, there are significant differences between the two concepts. Ethnicity, which relates to culturally contingent features, characterizes all human groups. It refers to a sense of identity and membership in a group that shares common language, cultural traits (values, beliefs, religion, food habits, customs, etc.), and a sense of a common history. All humans are members of some cultural (ethnic) group, sometimes more than one. Most such groups feel—to varying degrees of intensity—that their way of life, their foods, dress, habits, beliefs, values, and so forth, are superior to those of other groups.



The most significant quality of ethnicity is the fact that it is unrelated to biology and can be flexible and transformable. People everywhere can change or enhance their ethnicity by learning about or assimilating into another culture. American society well illustrates these facts, consisting as it does of groups of people from hundreds of different world cultures who have acquired some aspects of American culture and now participate in a common sense of ethnic identity with other Americans.

Ethnic identity is acquired, and ethnic features are learned forms of behaviour. Race, on the other hand, is a form of identity that is perceived as innate and unalterable. Ethnicity may be transient and even superficial. Race is thought to be profound and grounded in biological realities. Ethnocentrism is based in a belief in the superiority of one’s own culture over others, and it too may be transient and superficial. Racism is the belief in and promotion of the racial worldview described above. Ethnocentrism holds skin colour and other physical features to be irrelevant as long as one is a member of the same culture, or becomes so. The racial worldview holds that, regardless of behaviour or cultural similarities, a member of an inferior race (who is usually perceived to be so by means of physical features) can never be accepted. Race is an invented, fictional form of identity; ethnicity is based on the reality of cultural similarities and differences and the interests that they represent. That race is a social invention can be demonstrated by an examination of the history of the idea of race as experienced in the English colonies.

[pieter]

Ethnocentrism



Ethnocentrism in social science and anthropology—as well as in colloquial English discourse—means to apply one's own culture or ethnicity as a frame of reference to judge other cultures, practices, behaviors, beliefs, and people, instead of using the standards of the particular culture involved. Since this judgment is often negative, some people also use the term to refer to the belief that one's culture is superior to, or more correct or normal than, all others—especially regarding the distinctions that define each ethnicity's cultural identity, such as language, behavior, customs, and religion. In common usage, it can also simply mean any culturally biased judgment. For example, ethnocentrism can be seen in the common portrayals of the Global South and the Global North.



Ethnocentrism is sometimes related to racism, stereotyping, discrimination, or xenophobia. However, the term "ethnocentrism" does not necessarily involve a negative view of the others' race or indicate a negative connotation. The opposite of ethnocentrism is cultural relativism, which means to understand a different culture in its own terms without subjective judgments.

The term "ethnocentrism" was first applied in the social sciences by American sociologist William G. Sumner. In his 1906 book, Folkways, Sumner describes ethnocentrism as "the technical name for the view of things in which one's own group is the center of everything, and all others are scaled and rated with reference to it." He further characterized ethnocentrism as often leading to pride, vanity, the belief in one's own group's superiority, and contempt for outsiders.

Over time, ethnocentrism developed alongside the progression of social understandings by people such as social theorist, Theodore W. Adorno. In Adorno's The Authoritarian Personality, he and his colleagues of the Frankfurt School established a broader definition of the term as a result of "in group-out group differentiation", stating that ethnocentrism "combines a positive attitude toward one's own ethnic/cultural group (the in-group) with a negative attitude toward the other ethnic/cultural group (the out-group)." Both of these juxtaposing attitudes are also a result of a process known as social identification and social counter-identification.



medium.com/@brimorales/western-feminisms-ethnocentric-ideals-and-lack-of-intersectionality-in-itself-are-not-e6baee141f92

Links:

English: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnocentrism (For more information about ethnocentrism)
Polish: pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etnocentryzm
Slovak: sk.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etnocentrizmus
German: de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnozentrismus

[pieter]

For Karl in Danish.

Etnocentrisme



Etnocentrisme (sammensat af græsk ethnos = folk og en afledning af latin centrum = midtpunkt, midte, ordet er på dansk kendt siden 1965 men stammer fra William Graham Sumner, som indførte det i 1906) er et begreb, der bruges for at beskrive en tendens til (ubevidst) at bruge normer og værdier fra ens egen kultur som målestok for at bedømme og forstå andre kulturer eller samfund. Man sætter sig selv og sin kultur (sin etnicitet) i midten og bedømmer alle andre kulturer ud fra graden af afvigelse fra denne norm.

Etnocentrisme betegnes undertiden som en hoven selvfølelse betinget af, at ens egen gruppe udgør grundlaget for sammenligning med andre grupper, der så af samme årsag bliver mindre positivt bedømt. Etnocentrisme kan også være forbundet med angst for andre folkeslag og nationer (xenofobi) Tendensen til etnocentrisme er universel, fordi alle mennesker er født og opvokset i en kultur, ud fra hvis synspunkt verden anskues. Hvor etnicitet kan opfattes positivt som et middel til at styrke fællesskabsfølelse eller gruppesolidaritet, er den gængse opfattelse af etnocentrisme negativ, da den kan lede til fx nationalisme og xenofobi. Det skyldes dels en positivistisk opfattelse af, at opfattelsen og skildringen af andre kulturer og samfund som et ideal bør være neutral eller objektiv, det vil sige holdningsløs, dels at de fleste fordomsfulde holdninger har et negativt præg og derfor kan (og ofte vil) føre til en modvilje mod det fremmede.

Et eksempel på etnocentrisme er Papalagi, tale af sydhavshøvdingen Tuiavii fra Tiavea. Bogen beskriver det europæisk liv set gennem Samoa-høvdingen Tuiaviis øjne.

Problemstillingen med etnocentrisme er især af betydning ved udforskningen af ældre historiske samfund ved brug af antikke (fx græske eller romerske) skriftlige kilder. Efter som de antikke forfattere i høj grad så på og opfattede fremmede (fx keltiske, germanske) samfund gennem en etnocentristisk synsvinkel, forsøgte de at skabe forståelse for det fremmede ved enten at sammenligne det med noget, der var kendt, eller ved omvendt at fremhæve det fremmedartede som en anderledeshed i forhold til det kendte. Denne tendens blev fremmet ved, at etnografer ofte vil have en tendens til at fremhæve det fremmedartede, der forekommer dem underligt, og fremhæve dette som noget typisk, hvilket let kan fortegne billedet af de(t) skildrede samfund.

[pieter]

Russian ethnocentric thinking. In Russia the Eastern-Slavic, Russian Orthodox (Christian), European culture must be preserved.

[pieter]

German politician and writer Thilo Sarrazin stirred a huge outcry in Germany when he argued in an explosive book that Muslim immigrants were undermining German society by failing to integrate. He speaks to Douglas Herbert about why he feels he's been made a scapegoat for raising a taboo.




Seldom has a book in Germany been more inflammatory than the one written by Thilo Sarrazin, a former politician and former member of the board of Germany's Bundesbank. On 460 pages he described what he saw as the negative effects of the immigration of Muslims to Germany. While his provocative theses were greeted with approval by many people, politicians reacted with indignation. What has happened since the book was first published this past summer?

[pieter]

Leftwing ethnocentrism in Germany

[karl]

Sept 3, 2021 12:09:46 GMT -7 pieter said:

For Karl in Danish.

Etnocentrisme



Etnocentrisme (sammensat af græsk ethnos = folk og en afledning af latin centrum = midtpunkt, midte, ordet er på dansk kendt siden 1965 men stammer fra William Graham Sumner, som indførte det i 1906) er et begreb, der bruges for at beskrive en tendens til (ubevidst) at bruge normer og værdier fra ens egen kultur som målestok for at bedømme og forstå andre kulturer eller samfund. Man sætter sig selv og sin kultur (sin etnicitet) i midten og bedømmer alle andre kulturer ud fra graden af afvigelse fra denne norm.

Etnocentrisme betegnes undertiden som en hoven selvfølelse betinget af, at ens egen gruppe udgør grundlaget for sammenligning med andre grupper, der så af samme årsag bliver mindre positivt bedømt. Etnocentrisme kan også være forbundet med angst for andre folkeslag og nationer (xenofobi) Tendensen til etnocentrisme er universel, fordi alle mennesker er født og opvokset i en kultur, ud fra hvis synspunkt verden anskues. Hvor etnicitet kan opfattes positivt som et middel til at styrke fællesskabsfølelse eller gruppesolidaritet, er den gængse opfattelse af etnocentrisme negativ, da den kan lede til fx nationalisme og xenofobi. Det skyldes dels en positivistisk opfattelse af, at opfattelsen og skildringen af andre kulturer og samfund som et ideal bør være neutral eller objektiv, det vil sige holdningsløs, dels at de fleste fordomsfulde holdninger har et negativt præg og derfor kan (og ofte vil) føre til en modvilje mod det fremmede.

Et eksempel på etnocentrisme er Papalagi, tale af sydhavshøvdingen Tuiavii fra Tiavea. Bogen beskriver det europæisk liv set gennem Samoa-høvdingen Tuiaviis øjne.

Problemstillingen med etnocentrisme er især af betydning ved udforskningen af ældre historiske samfund ved brug af antikke (fx græske eller romerske) skriftlige kilder. Efter som de antikke forfattere i høj grad så på og opfattede fremmede (fx keltiske, germanske) samfund gennem en etnocentristisk synsvinkel, forsøgte de at skabe forståelse for det fremmede ved enten at sammenligne det med noget, der var kendt, eller ved omvendt at fremhæve det fremmedartede som en anderledeshed i forhold til det kendte. Denne tendens blev fremmet ved, at etnografer ofte vil have en tendens til at fremhæve det fremmedartede, der forekommer dem underligt, og fremhæve dette som noget typisk, hvilket let kan fortegne billedet af de(t) skildrede samfund.

Tak Pieter, det var meget venligt af dig.

With the subject of Ethnocentrism, my self would venture to say, this is as old as the human race of Homo Sapiens. For once agriculture was discovered and the keeping of animals as herd animals, there was then a conflict between hunter-gathering peoples. For those hunter-gathering peoples found it much easier to kill a herd animal then to risk in the wild. Perhaps this trait become ingrained in to our present mind set, who knows for sure..

Whilst then as above, we do have the tendency to dismiss others not of our kind as undesirables for as they are then unwanted and most all attempts are then to remove them out as foreign.

Irregardless as above, our world is in constant change rather we wish it so or not, there needs be for each group, to modify their acceptance with compromises as a peaceful resolution. But of course this is not occuring, for each group believes theirs is the only truth whilst the other needs be to come in this stead to their camp of thought..

Just some thoughts..

Karl

[pieter]

Karl,

You're welcome. I liked your reply. In my opinion there must be effort of both sides -Indigenous natives of a continent, country or Island -UK/Ireland- to coexist, merge, be united and form a new peaceful society. Therefor the Indigenous natives should be less exclusive, xenophobe, discriminatory and racist and the migrants, refugees and foreign expats should be less demanding, complaining and not use the Woke culture for everything. Painful compromises, adaptions, reforms must be made to be able to coexist and a lot of healing, mediation, diplomacy and negotiation and gatherings are necessary for that.

Foreigners, migrants, Africans, Asians and Middle Easterners must understand that this is Europe and will stay Europe, not like the old Europe, but like the New Europe we presently have. Generations of migrants, expats and refugees have put a lot of effort in integration, learning European languages, customs and traditions. In the same time they kept something of their heritage and add that to the European culture. Others couldn't transform themselves, couldn't integrate, couldn't learn and stayed in their Turkish or Moroccan, Turkish language, Kurd Language, Arabic language and Berber language culture and Muslim communities unable to communicate with Dutch or other Europeans. From the other side you had stubborn Indigenous native Europeans who after decades refused to accept people of color, who are black or from another religion, ethnicity, culture or nationality, These Indigenous native Europeans keep an internalised xenophobia, not understanding and not wanting to understand the migrant, the newcommer.

Many other Indigenous native Europeans have accepted the integrated migrants and refugees and understand that partly due to aging we need immigration. But fact is that there is often to much immigration and that to many refugees come to Western Europe and that some large neighbourhoods are area (urban agglomerations) have become predominantly alien, migrant, foreign territories. It is understandable that Dutch, Belgian, French, German and Danish people don't like that. We have to find a balance and avoid explosive situations, conflict and (civil) war. We have had 70 years of peace, prosperity, Freedom and Democracy. We want to keep and maintain that and for that you have to work hard a society and community of people.

Cheers,
Pieter