Battle in Ukraine

[pieter]

[pieter]

[pieter]

A quite sad video about the truth about this war

[pieter]

[pieter]

[karl]

Pieter

Perhaps myself should not say anything or perhaps it needs be spoken. There is nothing heroic about war and combat, it is all about death and destruction. What other eyes needs be to see, is the remains of crews in destroyed armored fighting vehicles, what they look like ripped to pieces by hot metal shards from weapons hit that has melted or blown through the armored skin and then ripped about through the interior. This will occur in milliseconds resulting in instant death of the crews with most often a burn out of the interior and/or detonation of stored ammunition in the racks.

The above is a simplistic view of death and destruction of war time action, for there is the multitude of destruction of civilian lives and property. For as well those not connected to combat actions but simply caught up whilst simply trying to live and survive.

It is not old men who are combat solders, but the young men that many will never grow old. For who is the present day enemy, will be Tomorrow's friend.

Karl

[pieter]

Karl,

You have spoken out the truth and your truth. War brings destruction, suffering, causes for future conflicts, hatred and revenge thoughts of those whom lost loved ones and sometimes entire families. The Second World War hit you hard. It took your father, so you grew up as a teenager and adolescent without a father and no doubt saw the destruction in Germany 🇩🇪 of bombed cities and towns. My family in Rotterdam and Warsaw were hit by that same war that took your father away. Rotterdam and Warsaw were flattened. And so was Arnhem, the city I live in now for 30 years and all the towns and villages surrounding Arnhem. Nijmegen, Renkum, Oosterbeek, Doorwerth, Heveadorp, Velp, Westervoort and etc. Market Garden destroyed all these villages and the city Arnhem. It left scars in many places in Europe. Living in Europe means living with the shadows, scars and marks of the Second World War. Many buildings, churches, farms still carry marks of bullets, shrapnel and the differences between old parts and new build restored parts. You see the differences in Colour and used material. Some ugly new build towns and cities show where once beautiful cities stood (examples of that are Arnhem, Nijmegen and Enschede, an Eastern Dutch Town on the German border),
Some families whom were wiped out left dark holes and emptiness for sometimes individuals whom were the only survivors. This dark hole 🕳️ is cause of great pain, grief, suffering , sadness and longing for lost familymembers by some people whom survided the war and lost their father, mother, brothers, sisters, aunts, uncles, cousins and nieces. I talk about Jewish people, but also some ethnic Polish, Sinti and Roma, Belarussian, Russian and German people. Concentration camps but also families that were wiped out by bombing bombers, tank and artillery grenade or rocket 🚀 fire. The Second World War was a destructive war which sometimes went in murderous waves of killing spree’s. Today that vicious Ukraine War 🇺🇦 shows the massive loss of life of young Russian and Ukrainian men, but also shows civilian losses due to bombed apartment buildings, houses, shopping malls, schools, kindergardens, hospitals, streets, boulevards and power stations.

Pieter

[Jaga]

Hello Pieter,

thanks for bring this situation. it is good to learn about other casulties of the war, who were able to survive

[pieter]

Jaga,

I hope in a strange way that this war moves towards some sort of equilibrium and some kind of draw. That despite the painful losses on both sides, the war crimes, the suffering, the fresh wounds, scars and all the Post Traumatic Stress Disorders (PTSDs), the Ukrainians and Russians find a kind of Modus vivendi. A way of life or a way of dealing with each other's differences. The conflicting Russian and Ukrainian parties will have to decide to continue with what binds them, even if they do not share the same values ​​and norms.

As a compromise between individuals (Vladimir Putin and Volodymyr Zelenskyy), groups (the Russian army and the Ukrainian Army and Russian militia's and paramilitary forces and Ukrainian militia's and paramilitary forces), parties (the Ukrainian and Russian government parties and propaganda machines), agencies (the Ukrainian and Russian intelligence agencies), or countries (Russia and Ukraine) who disagree on one or more points, but still opt for the best of all possible worlds. With the help of both Ukrainian allies on one side and Russian allies on the other.

The Americans (USA), Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Switzerland (Geneva/Basel/Zurich), the European Union, Great Britain, France, Italy, Ireland, Germany, Poland, Spain, Portugal, Greece (which is an Orthodox Christian country both with Ukraine and Russia), China, India, Palistan, Syria, Iran, Israel, Turkey, Brazil, Japan, South Korea, Vatican City, Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg, Denmark, Norway and Sweden.

Somewhere a diplomatic, multilateral, bilateral (between Ukraine and Russia), financial, economic, military (cold or warm peace) and political solution has to be found.

Even if that is a temporary solution like South and North Korea, West Germany and East Germany during the cold war.

It is an extremely complicated situation in all areas. The longer the war continues, the greater the division, hatred, intransigence, aversion, distrust, and fear and anger becomes between the two countries and peoples.

You should actually look at the benefits of ending this bloody and brutal war for both the Russians and Ukrainians. This War is already taking place to long (2014-2023...) and took to many lives, created to many wounds and trauma's and has led to massive destruction in Ukraine.

The Russians must realize that through this war they have strengthened the Ukrainian identity, Ukrainian patriotism and Ukrainian nationalism. The Russians must also realize that this war has divided the Russians themselves to the bone. That this war has serious consequences for the Russian people, the Russian economy and the Russian society. All those fatherless and sonless families because of all those fathers, sons and uncles and cousins ​​and therefore husbands who died.

What are the trade, peace, financial-economic and geopolitical benefits of ending this war?

The Russians can (could) learn from the Germans, the British (Northern Ireland -the Troubles-), Israel (the Occupied Westbank and Intifadas), the Pakistani occupation of Balochistan (originally Afghanistan) that the occupation of the land of another people leads to problems, Intifada, Partisan struggle, Independence movements and long-term resistance by a well-motivated and militant Underground resistance movement will lead.

The Ukrainians will never recognize Russian authority and the Russians know that there are many ethnic Ukrainians in Russia who can carry out acts of sabotage. Just as the Israeli occupation of the West Bank strengthened the identity of the Palestinian Arabs in the West Bank, Lebanon, Syria and Jordan, the continued occupation of the Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk regions will strengthen Ukrainian identity, resistance and thus resistance.

Where the Ukrainians and Russians were East Slavic brother peoples with good political, trade, cultural and human relations, you now see in all areas that these peoples are divided and split and that there is an enormous schism within the East Slavic world.

While peaceful, pragmatic, political, financial, economic, trade, scientific, educational, cultural and human relations could make this East Slavic area one of the richest, most prosperous and best functioning regions in the world, the area now belongs to a of the most polluted, most corrupt, degraded and damaged areas in the world. Only because of a leader's fear, egos, lust for power, ethniccentrism, historical ambitions and behind him some smaller leaders with a Soviet and Tsarist Imperialist mindset.

Both Russia and the Ukraine could still do a lot to tackle corruption, nepotism, clientelism, fraud and too much power among the few. We must realize that the Soviet and Tsarist legacies stand in the way of many things.

The West and the Ukraine must realize where the fear of the leaders of the Russian Federation and a large part of the Russian people for NATO expansion to the East comes from (Napoleon and Hitler), and Russia must realize why the Ukraine moves towards the West (the EU and the United States and the United Kingdom - the strong present Ukrainian ties with London-) and wants to become a member of the EU and NATO. Both sides must therefore understand the fear, anger, distrust, ambitions, desires, justified demands, as well as unjustified (unrealistic) demands of the other.

Much can be understood with rational analysis of the past. Several layers of history play a role here. Ancient history, New history and the latest history (Newest History). The conflict is rooted in political, geographic (territory), agricultural land: 71.2% (2018 est.) Arabable Land: 56.1% (2018 est.) (According to the CIA Factbook), Commodities, Resources (chemicals, agricultural products, timber, minerals, coal, diamond, gold, platinum group metals (PGMs), nickel, iron ore, uranium and other metals), Industrial (the Industrial Donbas and Luhansk areas), Religious (conflict between Ukrainian-op Bysantium & Kiev oriented church moving more and more towards Western Christianity- branch on the one hand and the Russian Orthodox Eastern branch which is Moscow oriented) disagreements, tensions and schisms between the Ukrainians and the Russians. To the anger and frustration of the Russians, the Ukrainians are experiencing a development of orientation and movement towards the West. The Russians want to keep the Ukrainians and the Ukraine in the camp of the Russian Federation and Belarus, as it used to be in the Soviet Union and Tsarist Russia when Russia, Ukraine and Belarus were united in one Great East Slavic Empire. The Russians have seen that empire disappear since the collapse of the Soviet Union. And that causes sadness, anger and frustration in many Russians and an antipathy, aversion and hatred against the West (the EU, the USA and NATO) and also increasingly against the Ukrainians.

Peace or a long-term truce now seems impossible and unattainable, but that should be the goal.

Greeting,
Pieter
The Netherlands

P.S.- Original Dutch text Peter translated into English by Google translate.

[Jaga]

Pieter,

I believe that Ukraine would be able to regain all the territories that they lost during the most recent war. Right now we see the competition between a Wagner group and Putin's establishment. This is all good for Ukraine.

[karl]

Pieter

Just a few words of preplanning as this war as all wars will end once both sides tire of their losses. For with the immense combat damage of Ukrainian property and business losses, will come the event of rebuilding. For funding of various construction firms rather local or foreign, will the question of: who will bear the burden of cost?

These currant economic times have not been kind to Western states, and it is a very doughtful question of Eastern states to bear this cost. With this, the economic situation will Ukraine is somewhat at question even though Ukraine has been receiving untold value in free combat weapons and assistance from Western states at their cost without assistance from surrounding Eastern states with exception of Poland. For in this time of extreme, Poland has stepped up as true friend of Ukraine, it is to hope that Mr. Volodymyr, Zelenskyy will be honorable enough to give The Polish people and The Polish Government the credit and thanks for their valued help. Not only is Poland conducting their military assistance in brokerage of transfer of weapons to Ukraine at risk of retaliation from Mr. Putin in as well as serving a safe haven for Ukrainian refuges.

Then, there will be the Russian question of post war and post Putin {his health is shall we say, a bit at risk}, will The EU follow up with renewed relations with Russia and stay strictly European in both economic trade relations in as well as political.

There are a great many future decisions of post war, each to its self will determine the future. Trade is the life blood of modern industrial states.

Karl

[pieter]

May 2, 2023 17:19:08 GMT -7 Jaga said:

Pieter,

I believe that Ukraine would be able to regain all the territories that they lost during the most recent war. Right now we see the competition between a Wagner group and Putin's establishment. This is all good for Ukraine.

Dear Jaga,

Before you think otherwise I agree with you that Ukrainian territory is Ukrainian territory. Ukraine should get Crimea, and the Donbas and Luhansk territories which are occupied by the Russians and ethnic Russian and/or Pro-Russian Ukrainian separatists, back. But Russian warmongers wont stop and wont give back territory, the Russian propaganda on the long term will get more and more Russians on the war side. Old Czarist and Soviet/Stalinist desires are deeply rooted in many Russian leaders and Russian civilians.

The Little Russian identity which was a cultural, political, and ethnic self-identification of a population of Ukraine who aligned themselves as one of the constituent parts of the triune Russian nationality existed in the Ukrainain part of Czarist Russia, in the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic in the SovjetUnion and in Post-Sovjet Ukraine amongst Russophilian Ukrainians. Of course the Russian minority in Ukraine always felt connected to Russia, but many of these ethnic Russians since 2022 switched sides to Ukraine when they were bombed and when family members and friends were killed and wounded. These Russian Ukrainians became Ukrainians.

The Little Russian identity combined the cultures of Imperial Russia and Cossack Hetmanate.

This war will continue for some time and we have to be realisitic in the sense that a country with 147,182,123 people (Russia) attacks a country with 36,744,636 people (Ukraine). The Russian army is one of the largests armies in the world and gets support from Iran, Syria, North Korea and China. The Russian arms industries are working full power. If Ukraine and the West want to win this war, Ukraine must have it's own huge arms industry, massive financial and military backing (supplies) from the West and political good will in the West. I do believe that the Ukrainian army, the Ukrainian people and the Ukrainian president and administration are united in their effort, their fight/struggle and their battle to win this war.

When will Russia stop? We don't know. If there will be internal unrest, a toppling of the present Russian leadership and administration. But today it seems that 2 propaganda machines, 2 armies and 2 presidents and their administrations are working full speed to continue this war. Both sides desperately want to win this war. This makes peace efforts, calls for moderation, calls for Ceasefires, and diplomacy and meditation of Third parties (Turkey, Israel, and others) fruitless.

Cheers,
Pieter