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Post by pieter on May 20, 2023 5:07:50 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 20, 2023 5:10:29 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 20, 2023 5:12:39 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 20, 2023 9:06:39 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 20, 2023 9:07:23 GMT -7
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Post by pieter on May 20, 2023 9:08:33 GMT -7
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Post by karl on May 24, 2023 16:45:46 GMT -7
Pieter
It would appear that the masters of Polish authority remember everything from the last war and learnt nothing. It is much better to have a friend then an enemy for enemies are created, and friends made. Yes of course, if it is a Kaczinski mindset, Russians are what they are, a curse on the landscape. But this needs not to be a reality. For whatever is at present between Ukraine and Russia will pass in time and that is for them to decide. For at least this issue is kept contained between those two, but to rattle swords at Russia is not the road of peace or at least in the manner of cross trade.
Just for the reason as present, Poland is a member of the EU does not in fact make them immune to irresponsible actions, for Poland now carries the responsibility of a trusted EU member and it takes but one mistake to remove that trust and create a situation to be shared by all EU members alike. This is the responsibility of membership trust and maturity.
These combate weapons are not toys to banter around with, but real-life responsibility of use upon the situation of unprovoked invasion or real-life threats.
A Generals work and existence is War, without war, the Generals are out of business and looking for another occupation, but, they are under the command of civilian authority and civilian authority had better be absolutely correct at all times.
Karl
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Post by pieter on May 24, 2023 18:10:50 GMT -7
Pieter
It would appear that the masters of Polish authority remember everything from the last war and learnt nothing. It is much better to have a friend then an enemy for enemies are created, and friends made. Yes of course, if it is a Kaczinski mindset, Russians are what they are, a curse on the landscape. But this needs not to be a reality. For whatever is at present between Ukraine and Russia will pass in time and that is for them to decide. For at least this issue is kept contained between those two, but to rattle swords at Russia is not the road of peace or at least in the manner of cross trade.
Just for the reason as present, Poland is a member of the EU does not in fact make them immune to irresponsible actions, for Poland now carries the responsibility of a trusted EU member and it takes but one mistake to remove that trust and create a situation to be shared by all EU members alike. This is the responsibility of membership trust and maturity.
These combate weapons are not toys to banter around with, but real-life responsibility of use upon the situation of unprovoked invasion or real-life threats.
A Generals work and existence is War, without war, the Generals are out of business and looking for another occupation, but, they are under the command of civilian authority and civilian authority had better be absolutely correct at all times.
Karl
Both the Polish authorities and population remember the Russian occupation of the Eastern part of Poland and Warsaw for for 123 years by Czarist Russia from 1795 until 1918, the Polish–Soviet War (late autumn 1918 / 14 February 1919 – 18 March 1921) mainly fought by Russians on the Soviet side, the Polish Operation of the NKVD (Soviet security service) in 1937–1938, an anti-Polish mass-ethnic cleansing operation of the NKVD carried out in the Soviet Union against Poles (labeled by the Soviets as "agents") during the period of the Great Purge (Deaths +/− 111,091), the Sovjet invasion and occupation of Poland from 1939 until 1941 (between 150,000 and 1,000,000 Poles died, during these 2 years of Sovjet occupation) and after the 'liberation of Poland in 1945', about 44 year of Communist oppression by Polish henchmen of the Soviets, and Soviet army and KGB presence in Poland. The Soviets assisted, informed, backed and supported the Polish Stalinists and communists. If you understand that and understand that today many Polish people stil hate Russians and Germans, you understand the policies and measures and rearmament of Poland. The Poles fear and loathe the Russians, the Poles distrust Russians, they don't like Russians, they aren't fond of Russians. Polish relations with Russia from 1989 until 2021 (or 2014) were and are pure pragmatic, diplomatic, tactical and strategic. Diplomatic in the bilateral (Poland-Russian Federation relationship) and multilateral (NATO and EU relations with the Russian Federation) sense, Financial in the sense of Russian tourism to Poland and Russian businesses and companies in Poland, economical in the sense of Polish export and trade with Russia and Polish import of Russian products. The Russian market is a huge market for Polish businessmen, Polish companies and Polish farmers who export Polish meat, Polish vegetables and Polish fruit to Russia.
They learnt everything from the last war and learnt nothing. But the Poles aren't the only ones. In the interslavic relations a lot of healing, repair work, diplomacy, mediations and negotiations are needed to normalise the situation in these huge Eastern-Slavic and Werstern slavic spaces. Karl you also have to take into account that Western Slavs (Poles, Czechs, Slovaks and Sorbs) are different people than the Eastern Slavs (the Russians, Ukrainians and Belarussians). The Western slavs have the latin alphabet and mainly the Roman Catholic and Protestant faiths, the Easten slavs have their Cyrillic alphabet and Eastern Orthodox christian faiths and the Ukrainian Greek Catholic church (Eastern rite).
You are right that it is much better to have a friend then an enemy for enemies are created, and friends made. Unfortunately both Poles mistrust Russians and Russians mistrust Poles. Russians see Poles as allies of the Americans, Brits and Germans, the Russians see that the Poles support Ukraine, Georgia and the Baltic states. The Poles saw that Russia attacked Hungary (1956), Czechoslovakia in 1968, Afghanistan in 1978 (from 1978 until 1990), Chechenia in 1992-1994 (First Chechen War) and 1999–2009 (Second Chechen War), Georgia (the Russo-Georgian War - 7–12 August 2008 (5 days)) and Ukraine (the armed conflict between Russia and Ukraine from 2014 until today -2023-).
Russians are what they are, a curse on the Ukrainian (Crimea, Donbas and Luhansk), Polish (Kaliningrad) and Lithuanian landscape (Kaliningrad). This indeed should not be the reality. The bloody war between Ukraine and Russia will pass in time. That is for the Russians and Ukrainians to decide. I don't think that the war will be contained between Russia and Ukraine, if the war lasts for a long time. The war will spread to other countries, the longer it continues. To rattle swords at Russia is not the road of peace or at least in the manner of cross trade. But I don't know if the Poles and Ukrainians believe in Peace and Russia on it's part keeps attacking Ukraine and occupying parts of Ukraine (Crimea, the Donbas and Luhansk regions_.
Poland is a member of the EU, NATO, the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE), the Visegrád Group (also known as the Visegrád Four, the V4, or the European Quartet), the Weimar Triangle (together with Germany and France), the United Nations and other organisations. This does not makes them immune to irresponsible actions. Poland now carries the responsibility of a trusted EU member. If Poland the mistake to remove that trust and create a situation to be shared by all EU members alike, that will raise concerns of other more distant member states with more restraint towards the coflict.
The combat weapons for the Ukrainians and of the Polish army aren't toys to banter around with, but real-life responsibility of use upon the situation of unprovoked invasion or real-life threats.
The civilian authority and civilian authority must keep their cool, restraimt and better be absolutely correct at all times.
Pieter |
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Post by karl on May 24, 2023 19:12:10 GMT -7
Pieter
The reference material presented is both factual and represents the difference in mind set between the East and us in the West. Hate is an awful burden to bear, and at least myself, do hope these people will come to their senses before an escalation arises from their careless actions. For all of their banners and touting, one very large nuclear hit brings reality to light, for they are first in line then us, and for what?
Mr. Putin is not well, and after him will be what the future brings for both the Russian people and ourselves. With this, the future of the Ukrainian action, will it be continued under new Russian leadership or resolved with a pull out of Russian forces. This is our respective governments must preplan for the fore seeable future. For with a primary plan and back up as a pivot point of action is a primary goal. For if it is a military action, then so be it. If it is a resolution by the Russians, so be it as once again the goal. If the Ukrainians do not agree, then they are out of the question, it needs be to the West and Russians make the decisions. It is simple the course of reality.
Karl
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