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Post by Eric on Nov 16, 2005 2:40:23 GMT -7
Russia probably has the strictist agricultural import regulations in the world - Russians are very careful about what they eat. Actually, the majority of former Soviet and socialist countries have at least some agricultural products banned for import into Russia, and the real reason is actually sanitary conditions. You would actually be surprised at the conditions in Russian food processing plants - they're better than you would think based on "common assumption". Moldavia is complaining bitterly, bceause most of its income comes from exporting food to Russia. A recent inspection showed, however, that its sanitary conditions had fallen below acceptable levels, and so many imports were stopped. It's bad news from Moldavia, of course, but RUSSIA HAS NO OBLIGATION TO SUPPORT THESE COUNTRIES FOR FREE!
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Post by jimpres on Nov 16, 2005 6:48:44 GMT -7
I do like the music that came from Russia. And like the Ukraine, maybe because it was a part of Poland in the distant past.
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forza
Cosmopolitan
Posts: 514
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Post by forza on Nov 16, 2005 7:45:36 GMT -7
Eric, Food from Poland goes to all countries west of Palnad and is enjoed there. As for "standards" in Russia...
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Post by bescheid on Nov 16, 2005 8:49:01 GMT -7
Forza, I take it, the photo is of a Russian market.. At any rate, the sanitary conditions presented by the photo are simply unacceptable in the US. There are so many health violations apparent:
Unrefrigerated unpackaged meat, left out in the open subject to insect contact.
Lack of clear see through barrier as a sanitary defense against public contact and possible disease transmission.
Meat displayed directly upon the metal surface of the display counter in an unpackaged condition.
That is only a surface examination from an excellent photo.
Perhaps I am being over critical, but, are my observations that far off?
Sorry Eric, I meant not to criticize your country, it is just this: There are health standards that should be expected to meet the needs and protection of the public. If the photo reflects the currant accepted concepts of public health standards in currant use. This is a very deplorable situation, that begs addressing.
I am not comparing oranges and apples, American standards to Russian standards. I am simply addressing a standard that should be expected of an advanced modern nation
Charles
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nancy
European
Posts: 2,144
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Post by nancy on Nov 16, 2005 9:07:58 GMT -7
forza,
when was that photo taken? and where? and where (website) did you find it?
are you trying to provoke eric or just being z polot?
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forza
Cosmopolitan
Posts: 514
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Post by forza on Nov 16, 2005 9:30:24 GMT -7
bescheid, I just want to shove it up Eric's ... but ...I mean ... Really! Look how could it be that our products go wild around EU but not fulfill sanitary conditions for Russia. ... Quote from: Poland in EU Repoert page 17Now compare the standards:
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forza
Cosmopolitan
Posts: 514
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Post by forza on Nov 16, 2005 9:45:38 GMT -7
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Pawian
European
Have you seen my frog?
Posts: 3,266
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Post by Pawian on Nov 16, 2005 13:15:56 GMT -7
Yes, I'm trying to provoke Eric. He can handle it. Please, don`t. Eric is not a guy who easily hooks on provocations. His style is to remain serious and calm, no matter what is hurled at him and his beloved Russia. You will have to try really hard, but then it is going to become nasty, not only for Eric, but for all people here. They will feel bad reading such provocations. Let this forum be nice. Let it be our new "świecka tradycja."
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Post by bescheid on Nov 16, 2005 15:16:10 GMT -7
Hi Forza, The Poland report #EU, page 17. Now this is more like it. The employees are properly dressed for sanitation and professional appearance, a person by nature, if they look professional, they tend to act professional, prime prerequisite for Uniforms, the military learned that centuries ago.
The unpackaged food in the back wall case, is properly hung as wurst, it is cured and by nature of preparation, has a protective case that is stuffed.
The display case is enclosed on both the inside and outer side for protection from insect contamination and inadvertent customer handling with associated contamination. The enclosed food appears to be of a mix of packaged and partially cut ends of wurst and other cured and smoked meats, all still enclosed as sanitation common sense would prevail and dictate.
I have in past, been also licensed as a food handler, one of the assignments I did not particularly enjoy, with the exception of the nature of the assignments was working with the ladies.
I would certainly purchase my meats and wurst from that market with confidence.
I do not know who Eric is, if he truly is Russian, then he should be very basic and fairly straight forward. I would very much like to hear from his words the truth of the meat market, is this the norm in Russia, or an exception. If it is the truth, then so be it, he has no more control of his nations policies then any of us. If it is an exception and violation of their norm, that is ok, at least it is the truth. If I am being lied to with a smoke screen, I will know it, deception is a trained skill, for we as people are by our nature, truthfully until trained by circumstance or professional instruction for deception. Or in fear.
What now was the word of truth from our learned instructors:
Not every thing is as it appears: Not every one are as they portray: we are as we pretend.
Charles
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Post by bescheid on Nov 16, 2005 15:27:22 GMT -7
Dear Pawian, I have learned to respect your opinion and mind set through our various post exchanges and that of yours with others.
As such, I do entertain the feelings of your sensitivity and intrinsic understanding of fairness. For you do expect to be treated in a similar respect from others.
You are a person with strong feelings of personal freedom and as such, feel strongly that this should also be extended to others. I truly do respect this in you, for you will stand up and be counted in support of another that you feel is being unfairly judged.
As I earlier mentioned with my post reply to Forza, let Mr./Herr/ Eric stand up and be heard. For, he deserves this honour and it is to his credit to be allowed to do so.
Charles
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nancy
European
Posts: 2,144
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Post by nancy on Nov 16, 2005 15:30:12 GMT -7
If you ask as a moderator it is too early. Forza, I was not asking as a moderator, but I was curious about how recent the pictures are, and what you were up to, since usually you are a Peacemaker here (at least you tried with Raytan and Leslie ) Through your link, I found similar pictures of meat markets in Russia, dated 2003, so I suspect this is still the recent condition, at least in some places.
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Post by bescheid on Nov 16, 2005 15:49:14 GMT -7
Dear Forza,
This is a post from the heart, an intrinsic communication.
I have now just begun, to understand some what your feelings, this stemming from an unpleasant past. I know that you folks suffered very severely from the past war from two armies that over took you country, and severely abused your fellow Polish people and others that were placed into the death camps located in various regions of your country.
I am so very sorry for that...Very little comfort, I know, but, it is the best I can do.
My question: Are all you Polish folks, so loving of freedom? You would sacrifice your selves against a Superior force and numbers? I am of course referring to the past, which has a tendency to portray into the present. The sacrifice I refer to, is not military, not by a long shot, it is the portrayed feelings projected through extension of collateral recognition that you remember the past, and your former enemies had best not forget.
Or am I wrong?
There is nothing wrong either way Dear Forza, it is just a feeling that I have received. Either way, you have my most respect and support.
Charles
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Post by kaima on Nov 16, 2005 23:57:56 GMT -7
Looking at both of the pictures posted so far, I have seen both styles of presentation in the former Soviet Union in 1993. I bought food with no reluctance at both and never suffered ill effects to my tender, sanitary American stomach. I did, however, come to believe in 100 g of vodka weekly for medicinal purposes (no joke).
Remember that sanitary conditions are relative, and sadly I find it quite easy to believe that Moldava conditions are unsatisfactory to Russians. It is their choice to allow in what they wish.
Now Eric is a disaffected American who grew up in the States with a distinct dislike for most things American and a counterbalancing like for everything Russian. So perhaps he is more Russian today than American. If I had been exposed to life in Massachusetts, perhaps I would have a similar reaction. Now if he does react with a cool head then he has matured greatly over the old-younger Eric who was a bit of a ^&&*( and tossed a pretty good hissy-fit when he wished. Now bescheid, how many home kitchens in Germany have window screens to keep out flies? Not many in my memory. Sanitation is relative!
Kai
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Post by bescheid on Nov 17, 2005 9:31:27 GMT -7
Kai, Your statement of window fly screens was funny, but true.
But, my analysis of the sanitation conditions depicted by the Russian photograph will still stand, because that is true.
It is still my stand, that it is incumbent upon health departments in any modern country, to insure the public safety with governing health standards commensurate to prevailing conditions.
I may be naive in this respect though, for some reason or another, I have always understood that the Russian Dairy industry was highly excellent with their high standards of food handling. Milk is very prone to spoilage if not properly stored.
With the conditions of your climate, I would suspect that in the winter months, the opposite might be in order, instead of refrigeration, is it necessary to add some heat to keep the dairy products from freezing?
Thank you for your analysis of Mr. Eric. Now I have a much better base of understanding of his situation. Perhaps he now has found his calling and his heart will be at peace in his new home country.
Charles
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Post by kaima on Nov 17, 2005 10:19:06 GMT -7
CHarles,
Yes, I have no argument with your analysis of the photo and observations on sanitation. My understanding is that transportation is one of the major problems in keeping the economy going and building up a richer life for the people. It is a land of wonderful potential!
Kai
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